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View Full Version : Would the 500E be considered a 'widebody'?



amerh
02-26-2014, 12:03 PM
Had an conversation with a porsche guy in my office (has two porche's 993 and 997 turbo's). We got to talking about all the cool widebody Mercedes of the 80's, 90's...SEC's, some of the AMG C124 coupes, etc. He asked me if the 500E is considered a 'widebody' just due to the flaring of the wheel arches, and not more of the body panels. I said i think its considered a widebody. Thoughts?

gerryvz
02-26-2014, 12:19 PM
Had an conversation with a porsche guy in my office (has two porche's 993 and 997 turbo's). We got to talking about all the cool widebody Mercedes of the 80's, 90's...SEC's, some of the AMG C124 coupes, etc. He asked me if the 500E is considered a 'widebody' just due to the flaring of the wheel arches, and not more of the body panels. I said i think its considered a widebody. Thoughts?I don't consider the E500E to be a widebody in the truest sense ... just a standard body width with the front and rear fender lips flared out a bit, to accommodate a slightly wider track.

gsxr
02-26-2014, 12:39 PM
Compared to all the other 3 million 124's produced, it's sort of a widebody.

But in the general sense of the term, I think most people think "widebody" as "gargantuan fenders and wheels", which the stock 500E doesn't quite have.

:seesaw:

gerryvz
02-26-2014, 12:45 PM
An issue of semantics, IMO. To me a widebody would be a car with front/rear fenders significantly expanded/bulged over stock - a la BMW E30 M3, or an AMG widebody SEC, something like that.

That's different from a car with standard body dimensions on all panels except fender lips.

KarlC
02-26-2014, 12:47 PM
I've always thought of them as wide bodies as they came from the factory with a wider steel body.

How many cars can say that, very few compared to the billions made

szvook
02-26-2014, 03:14 PM
I've always thought of them as wide bodies as they came from the factory with a wider steel body.
Yep, that is a fact. Even the Hammer can't say that...

Stevester 500E
02-26-2014, 11:38 PM
+1 Widebody . If it ain't a narrow body, and it ain't a standard body . . . it's a wide body.

gerryvz
02-26-2014, 11:52 PM
All you guys have a very optimistic view of what a wide body car is. Wonder what you would call a flared fender E30 M3 or 560SEC AMG.....

Other than the wheel-arch lips there is no difference between a 500E and 400E in the body/panel width.

Oops, did I just sound like Clark Vader with that statement?!? Oy.

elbeik
02-27-2014, 01:31 AM
I personally believe the first notion of widebody that comes to mind is something to the likes of these:

https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/1.jpeg
https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/131.jpg
https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/133.jpg

Koening Specials, Gemballa and some other tuners references.

gerryvz
02-27-2014, 08:43 AM
I personally believe the first notion of widebody that comes to mind is something to the likes of these:

Koening Specials, Gemballa and some other tuners references.Thank you for illustrating what at "widebody" is.

https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/135.jpg

https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/101.jpg

https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/137.jpg

https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/139.jpg

gsxr
02-27-2014, 09:17 AM
LiquidIron (?) was making a 500E widerbody years ago, I wonder what ever happened to that project. Gerry, you gots any photos saved of that beast?

:apl:

gerryvz
02-27-2014, 09:45 AM
LiquidIron (?) was making a 500E widerbody years ago, I wonder what ever happened to that project. Gerry, you gots any photos saved of that beast?

:apl:Uhhh....hello McFly? Anybody home McFly?

http://www.500eboard.com/forums/showthread.php?739-An-afternoon-at-LiquidIron-s-shop-%28Germany%29

95_DB6GgLQs

gsxr
02-27-2014, 10:39 AM
LiquidIron... you are my density!!!

:hearts:

amerh
02-27-2014, 10:46 AM
Those widebody SEC's are timeless....I need one now...lol.

Maui
02-27-2014, 11:24 AM
I'm sorry, but most widebodies look phoney and very Bee Gee's to me. Just because you add some plastic and wider wheels doesn't mean you have a race car. It's like a Honda with fart can...Mehhh.

KarlC
02-27-2014, 11:45 AM
All you guys have a very optimistic view of what a wide body car is. Wonder what you would call a flared fender E30 M3 or 560SEC AMG.....

Other than the wheel-arch lips there is no difference between a 500E and 400E in the body/panel width.

Oops, did I just sound like Clark Vader with that statement?!? Oy.

So are we saying the 036 is a wide fender car then ?

What ever its called its custom OEM steel body work, that's very rare and special in my book !

gsxr
02-27-2014, 11:49 AM
I agree with Maui and Karl. Most widebodies tend to look cartoonish. The 500E in stock form is, IMO, an elegant (mini) widebody.

:grouphug:

8899
02-27-2014, 11:54 AM
My personal favorite:

http://www.carsofworld.com/images/audi-ur-quattro_key_8.jpg

500AMM
02-27-2014, 11:58 AM
I'm sorry, but most widebodies look phoney and very Bee Gee's to me. Just because you add some plastic and wider wheels doesn't mean you have a race car. It's like a Honda with fart can...Mehhh.

Mmmnnn - are you sure about that...have you ever tested...:D

But the chick factor!! :omg: ..I should like the Unhinged Troll to post a proper, convincing statement on that here.

Maui
02-27-2014, 12:00 PM
I think the rear fenders on the 500E could be a little more pronounced, but the front fenders are very nicely done.

gsxr
02-27-2014, 12:05 PM
I think the rear fenders on the 500E could be a little more pronounced, but the front fenders are very nicely done.
+1. The rears are a bit too subtle for my taste as well. But, whaddya gonna do... unless you are LiquidIron.

:D

amerh
02-27-2014, 12:18 PM
I agree some of the Koenig/Gemballa/etc kits for the SEC are somewhat cartoonish (ie the testarossa rear treatments, but I find the AMG version very easy on the eyes. I have a certain fondness for things from my youth....German cars of the era, Lynda Carter, 70's porn.....lol.

Next widebody in the stable hopefully....92-95 Porsche 928 GTS...another elegant mini widebody...:)

gerryvz
02-27-2014, 01:38 PM
I have a certain fondness for things from my youth....70's porn.....lol.:banana:

I still maintain that the E500E is not a true "widebody" in the classic sense of the word, and to the common understanding of the term among automotive aficionados. Even the front fender lipss are fairly subtle in terms of their widening. For the rear fender lips...you really have to look at least two times, perhaps three, to even see that they are wider than a standard W124 rear lip.

modzona
02-27-2014, 01:43 PM
To me the 500E is something in the middle.
The best widebody mod i have seen on a w124 car is this Lotec 300CE Turbo.
And its for sale. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=191063688842

https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/140.jpg
https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/141.jpg
https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/142.jpg

elbeik
02-27-2014, 02:28 PM
Got ridiculous?

http://www.bodykits.net/images/bodykits_net/168375/00.jpg
https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/143.jpg
https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/144.jpg
https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/145.jpg
https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/146.jpg

joef
02-27-2014, 03:14 PM
Got ridiculous?



https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/144.jpg


favorite widebody of all time

joef
02-27-2014, 03:20 PM
a couple more of the same car. the first 2 pictures were early on in it's construction (been a while since I read the owners thread/posts)

gerryvz
02-27-2014, 03:22 PM
I think I just threw up in my own mouth a little....

Do these 124 drivers think these cars are going to get them LAID, or something?

Maui
02-27-2014, 05:19 PM
Um.....i'm speechless....:leaving:


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

szvook
02-27-2014, 05:23 PM
Got rice...? Am I seeing things, or does the rear right badge read "fabulous"?
I've lost my appetite for the rest of the day...:flush:

joef
02-28-2014, 10:18 AM
Oh come on now. Nothing wrong being a little different! It's a tad extreme, but looks good non the less.

If that car was not bagged or on hydraulics, and sitting at a decent lowered height, it would be much better.

500AMM
02-28-2014, 11:32 AM
Oh come on now. Nothing wrong being a little different! It's a tad extreme, but looks good non the less.

If that car was not bagged or on hydraulics, and sitting at a decent lowered height, it would be much better.

+1

IIRC is that car on air shocks, read it on a forum somewhere. This car has crossed a limit for what I associate with a Widebody. I don't say it is bad or ugly - but it's a heavily customized car going into the Lowrider segment. And you'll hardly see this car on any Mercedes-Benz GtG anyway, those guys don't attract to that. Peps are different, some like Citroen 2CVs and some like Trucks, so I take it for what it is, it's a cool style. :-)

szvook
02-28-2014, 03:07 PM
If that car was not bagged or on hydraulics, and sitting at a decent lowered height, it would be much better.
Yeah, but it's not. The owner of this example should have bought a Honda and left the Benz alone. No sense of style to speak of. Only a Guido or a Ricer would desecrate a Benz in this manner and only a Douche would slap "fabulous" on the trunk lid.

elbeik
02-28-2014, 03:33 PM
It's hideous. And senseless. The owner should be Force choked.

bing
02-28-2014, 04:55 PM
Got ridiculous?


https://www.500eboard.com/forums/images/imported/2014/02/143.jpg




Minus the hood this could have been an E60 AMG “Black Series”, first ever!!:p:p

I think the fenders (just the fenders) look good on this .

gerryvz
02-28-2014, 05:09 PM
That hood leading edge modification looks STUPID.

szvook
02-28-2014, 05:26 PM
That hood leading edge modification looks STUPID.
Yep, the hood edge should have been kept straight. The part that gets me, someone decided to actually create that design and build it thinking it looks good...never mind the tasteless morons who bought it and actually slapped it on their Benz.

J-Sauce
03-01-2014, 01:06 AM
Wow, you guys are harsh. I'd hate to read what the posts would be regarding my car if I were not a forum member and someone found it online for sale.

That being said, I agree that the 500 is not quite a wide body in the true sense of the word. If a car doesn't make you think either testarossa or IROC-Z, or even miami vice, it probably isn't a wide body.

gerryvz
03-01-2014, 08:55 AM
I don't think too many people here are against MODS. It's just garish mods that prompt harshness.

Well done and tasteful mods are awesome !

Right J-Sauce? :nos:

gsxr
03-01-2014, 09:21 AM
Wow, you guys are harsh. I'd hate to read what the posts would be regarding my car if I were not a forum member and someone found it online for sale.
Justin, compared to the cars above, yours is bone stock!! We've seen photos of your car and even wrapped it looks pretty darn good. (Oh, and yours is FAST too, unlike the poseurs above.)



I don't think too many people here are against MODS. It's just garish mods that prompt harshness. Well done and tasteful mods are awesome ! Right J-Sauce?
Bingo. I gotta get working on that bottle install so I can [almost] be as cool as yous guys.


:apl:

Stevester 500E
06-18-2014, 11:07 PM
On that silver Chrysler 300 picture above, I mean modified 500e. . . .I think. . . .Are those subwoofers tucked behind the area where fog lights typically are located. . . ."Funky Cold Medina !"

Stevester 500E
06-18-2014, 11:15 PM
Gerry,
In all seriousness, if the outter door skins, fenders and bumpers were pulled out an inch on each side (a total of 2"), would you consider that a wide body?

I think it would look very nice. Add a J-Sauce style front bumper lip and it would look even nicer.
I hope vinyl wrapping takes-off and prices drop. Vinyl wrapping in a good alternative to painting. More and more color combinations might come out if it takes off.

gerryvz
06-19-2014, 12:30 AM
Gerry,
In all seriousness, if the outter door skins, fenders and bumpers were pulled out an inch on each side (a total of 2"), would you consider that a wide body?I guess it's a matter of interpretation. Many folks here thought that the E500E is a "widebody" because of its flared front and slightly flared rear lips. I did and do not agree....I think it's an overly "generous" interpretation, but I also understand the psychology of someone wanting to believe that their car is a widebody. I try to look at it more objectively, myself.

I consider something like an AMG 126 coupe with replaced fenders to be a proper "widebody".

So one question .. do people here consider my G-wagen (pictured below) to be a "wide body" because of the flared factory fender extensions over the standard G-wagen design, which didn't have the flares?

I do not consider the G-wagen to be a "wide body" even with the fender extensions, but I guess by the group's rules here it should be strongly considered a widebody.

Oh well, just a rhetorical question I guess.

Cheers,
Gerry

Stevester 500E
06-19-2014, 08:33 AM
I like the G-Wagon ! Would not consider it a wide body.
I think the reason some consider the 500e a wide body is indeed the fenders.
But, in addition, the stance makes it look wider because it is lower to the ground.

KarlC
06-19-2014, 09:26 AM
......
So one question .. do people here consider my G-wagen (pictured below) to be a "wide body" because of the flared factory fender extensions over the standard G-wagen design, which didn't have the flares?

I do not consider the G-wagen to be a "wide body" even with the fender extensions, but I guess by the group's rules here it should be strongly considered a widebody.

Oh well, just a rhetorical question I guess.

Cheers,
Gerry

G-wagen's are great, but they have a tacked on body kit like a Jeep, so no not a real wide body in my mind.

Glen
06-19-2014, 10:45 AM
I waffle on this one. On the one hand, a stock E500E definitely appears wider than a standard (narrow) body W124 so it can easily be considered a widebody. But, it's not truly what many people consider a widebody car like '80s AMG 126.

I think I will compromise and just call it a widebody 124, LOL.

...and re: the G-wagen with bolt on flares...nope, definitely not a widebody.

DerFuror
06-19-2014, 11:03 AM
I think I will compromise and just call it a widebody 124, LOL.

Good call, Glen.

30264

Klink
06-19-2014, 11:28 AM
During an awards trip I was on in September or October 1990 we were shown a slideshow teaser and given some information on some interesting new product in the pipeline. Most notable was the 500E, and the 140 chassis S-class.

One of the speakers said that the main reason for the Porsche assembly was that the car was too wide for the normal 124 assembly apparatus, and that Porsche was just up the tracks across town, had the perfect facility, and that the facility was underutilized at that time. He said that the facility in Bremen that built the 129's could accommodate the width but that would've introduced a bunch of other complications, not the least of which was the 129 was selling strong right out of the box and it had just been introduced. They could not build those fast enough. I remember thinking at the time "yes and you're probably making a lot on 129's and probably losing a fortune on that ridiculous hot rod 124. I was not a fan of the concept until I got to try the resulting product. He also said that there was a chance some of the equipment at Sindelfingen was going to be adapted and that they would bring the production fully in-house. Obviously, some of that came to pass and we saw the result in the 400E, the standard production plant obviously at that point accommodating the different floor pan and front console essentially straight from the 500...

So I think referring to that 500E as a "widebody" is perhaps fair enough, but to me that's really a "pre-MB AMG" term. I kind of like it though...

Somebody had asked if Porsche was in any way involved in the design and/or development of the car and the response was one of those "we can neither confirm nor deny" kind of things. That was no particular big deal to industry watchers because it was already well known that Porsche did an enormous amount of consultancy and development/endurance driving testing and so on for lots of different car companies, some local, some distant.

Remember Porsche was in a world of hurt right at that moment in its history. There was even a lot of talk about what corporate giant it was going to wind up in the possession of. The assumption that it was going to have to be sold was pretty much considered a foregone conclusion. Famously at around that same time a Mercedes bigwig made the statement in a German business publication that if Porsche was ever for sale "we will not allow anyone else to buy it".

:klink:



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ascension
07-18-2014, 01:00 PM
Oh come on now. Nothing wrong being a little different! It's a tad extreme, but looks good non the less.

If that car was not bagged or on hydraulics, and sitting at a decent lowered height, it would be much better.

Agreed and I really like that look. Body work flows and fits the lines unlike the others that look cartoonish but needs a real suspension, sane ride height and the AMG Ducktail + loose that stupid badge.
Real question then would be could it back up the look on the road?