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Thread: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

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    E500E Guru RicardoD's Avatar
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    OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Hello,

    Special thanks to our very own Site Honcho Gerry who connected me with Robert Fenton and let me know about a cherry 1991 Black 560SEC. I actually went to Robert's to look at the DB199 paint code car (because I hate black cars) but out of the corner of my eye saw this baby, under a layer of dust, took a peek inside, and said, "ummm, Robert, I want this one instead". "But you said no black!" and I replied "I just changed my mind." I put some money down and Robert went to work to prepare it for the final sale completed today.

    I now own this Salvage Title Not Actual Mileage SEC that everyone should stay away from because of SALVAGE and NAM all over the CarFax. Do not be confused by the glorious photos attached to this post that show a black beauty in glorious driver's condition to be enjoyed because it is SALVAGE and NAM. How can SALVAGE and NAM be this good?. Robert put new Michelin's on, checked it over, and told me to just drive that damn thing. No hidden $5k to $10k sink into this baby. Timing chain done and valve job and heads surfaced by Robert at tail end of previous ownership. He did leave me with a faulty coolant tank reservoir sensor, that bastard, and alignment, but left everything else perfect. This will not be a garage queen but something I should drive, drive, and drive.

    1991 560SEC ! ~145k miles [Salvage is from front end collision up high that took out the hood. If you know Robert he is the kind of guy that had a spare black hood and popped that back on the car to make it good as new. NAM is from new speedo installed with correct functioning ASR light]

    Oh and it has the glorious 1991 ASR!!!! You guys love ASR, right?

    And so begins the Owner's log for this car. I may bring it to Legends and thank the Honch in person in a few weeks.
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    Last edited by RicardoD; 07-04-2017 at 12:50 AM.
    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Now you have joined the club!! Congrats on getting this fine car, as you know it is a very different feel than the E500. When you are ready for lowering springs, wheels (et11) and H4 euro head lamps, we can help. Looks good, exciting stuff!!
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Also luckymike is having a SEC gtg very soon in NorCal area. There is a post here on the e500 forums
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    My first impressions on the 2 hour drive home was "wow, this is NOT a E500" Then I stopped and filled up the tank and settled down for the long cruise home. I usually have this "what the hell did I just do" feeling after a car purchase and "my wife is going to kill me". Then over the miles, I relaxed, and the charms of this car started to reveal itself. "Wow, these are super comfortable seats" "This thing is a bank vault on wheels, not a single rattle on this car". On some of the rougher roads near my home I never felt a better ride. Its a cruiser, the V8 is responsive, not overly so, but don't feel the need for more power. I handles like the heavy car that it is but the way you drive it has to adjust. Its not a car to be in hurry with (that's E500 territory). If I want a more alive dynamic car then I have the E500, but this 560sec is for long weekend drives to see the sites in California. I am still relatively new to the state with so much yet to explore. It looks great and drives the way I feel a stately S-class Mercedes should.

    Oh and the economy needle is some kind of joke, right? You can watch the fuel gauge for entertainment it almost moves as fast!
    Last edited by RicardoD; 07-03-2017 at 10:01 PM.
    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    The economy gauge is really more of a vacuum leak indicator. This was an 87k car in 1991 with a 1500 gas guzzler tax, for which nobody writing a 87k check gave a shot about. Pass the damn grey poupon and pay no attention to that needle unless the idle is very high (above 600 in idle at temp).
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Congratulations, Ricardo. Is a very nice car. I am really glad for you and I hope you will enjoy it for many miles to come.

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Now that the glamour shots are done, its time to reveal the flaws, and set about a plan to correct them.

    Mechanical

    • coolant reservoir sensor (did this on my E500, should be easy to address)
    • alignment, should have paid for this to get outsourced by Robert, Robert did show me his alignment lift in his shop, but he still needed to get the computer hookup to make that a service he provides. Kudos to Robert for the no charge mounting and balancing of the new Michelin tires I sent his way.


    Radio/Electric

    • I don't think all the speakers are working. Have to figure out where balance controls are on radio to figure this out. Hate the radio but it sounds fine to my ears.


    Cosmetic:

    • need a paintless dent removal person to come to my home and correct a few spots
    • there are some paint blemishes, but I will categorize this as "Patina". Robert did detail the exterior, but I want to take the paint to the next level. There is a new place I discovered in Campbell that I think is up to the task.
    • weird leather tear in the driver side passenger rear seat back, needs some Leatherique treatment in that area (rest of leather in car is gorgeous)
    • one of the lower cladding panels is lose, front passenger side, and will not properly click back into place, perhaps the mating panel side connector is damaged
    • interior carpet pulling loose on passenger side entry and a bit dirty (needs some shampoo)
    • rear center mount stop light seal is off, need to figure out how to fix this, and clean up area
    • I need a new headliner if I can get the original material/color.
    • blue paint around Mercedes logo is faded, this bothers me, since there is no star on the car, this should be perfect
    • oh, and cocomats, definitely need cocomats
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    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Typical star, new ones must be metal not the superseded plastic. Console looks like a phone at one time. Carpet tucks under there, the clips are different on the cladding and the removals are different but all of these parts are available
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Ricardo,

    You're so funny! What a great write up and intro to your new car. It looks fantastic. Congratulations.

    Any chance of bringing it up to San Carlos on July 15th? Would love to see it in person and get together with you again.

    Mike

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Mike, I would love to go to get schooled by some long time owners. Unfortunately I will be in Chicago that weekend visiting family. But looking forward to meeting other owners and getting guidance in person on a few issues.
    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Sounds good, Ricardo. I'm so excited for you to finally have one of your childhood dream cars. They are AMAZING. Every time I drive ours I can't believe I get to be its steward for a while.

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Congratulations, looks like a beautiful car.

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Black is beautiful.

    1992 500E
    1994 E500
    2011 E550 4Matic

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Ricardo, now that I am on a PC I wanted to address the radio. Looks like original Becker but I cannot tell from the picture. The fader button is on the center console and it is a roller forward and back. As you can see there aren't any cup holders on the car and sadly, that fader doesn't fair well when it gets moisture from coffee or soda spills. So turn on your radio and use your unit's balance control combined with that wheel to see if things improve. The door speakers have their own amplification built in, the rear speakers have amp units hidden behind the seat backs. If you keep the stock system, the wiring into the door speaker connects to the amp not the speaker. The amp can be shot and no sound comes out. I bypassed the amp by adding leads off the factory wiring and connecting directly to the speaker itself. The speakers can all be replaced if torn up as you know the heat takes a toll on paper cones circa 1991. I have replaced mine with some new pioneer speakers that dropped in. The grilles in back are tricky and brittle due to the heat as well.

    Center console wood removal is specific and care must be taken to A: not lose parts and B: break the tiny wood tabs that keep it all tightly together. When you get there, just ask away as it is different than the W124 in many respects.


    That seat tear is common in the back seat as it is leather sewn onto some very brittle fabric that usually crumbles to dust when handled so be careful. Also you might notice that the back seats are very small and while there is seating for 4, perhaps just your children on a trip longer than 10 minutes. Getting out of the back seat is interesting. Almost forgot, getting the seat backs out is easier on the coupe. Place hands under the seat back and the bottom cushion on the ends and lift up not out, toward the roof line BE CAREFUL as it takes some force to un hook them but the aluminum frame on the back is sharp like a meat slicer. Once you pop it up 4" or so, just hold on to the side leather and top so you can see the back side that isn't covered in leather.
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Congrats Ricardo,

    Looks like you have a fine example of your boyhood dream car and the last iteration at that. I love that Black/Tan leather combo. I wish our E500Es had offered that. That picture on your wall was your destiny. Maybe do ya think? it's the SAME CAR!!! Wouldn't that be something.

    Anyway you've already picked up a mentor in Louis. He sounds anxious to help you out. Pay attention he knows his stuff about these SECs.

    I will enjoy following your updates. Meanwhile, enjoy your new ride.

    Remember, Savor that long trip to your final destination. The trip is what's important not the destination.

    Take Care
    Terry

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Quote Originally Posted by TerryA View Post
    Congrats Ricardo,


    Anyway you've already picked up a mentor in Louis. He sounds anxious to help you out. Pay attention he knows his stuff about these SECs.

    Eager to help yes, but the heavy lifting is done already by Honch. I have read and experienced so much since 2012 on this car mostly by reading about it written by GVZ in a how to or had to read about it do to presentation of issues. BTDT provides much needed confidence to do the work yourself. In any event, high praise but we are all here to help out. The chassis is a very easy one to work on, simple and logical engineered car, a true S that has hand built all over it.
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Congrats on the purchase - amazing cars and I'm on my second. When I had to sell the first I knew I'd own another one day

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    It's a nice end to the child hood dream, and now that all the money has been spent. Junior is getting a Yugo

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/201972275420

    Fantastic 1988 Yugo GV. Daily driver, California car. Needs nothing!

    Up for sale is a car from my collection. A very nostalgic, quirky car guaranteed to bring a smile and great MPG; a 1988 Yugo GV.
    This car is in 100% daily driver condition, as every light, indicator and button works flawlessly (even the low-fuel light). The car runs and drives like new and has no
    runability issues. Hop in, turn the key and enjoy. Within the last 400 miles I have changed all fluids, inspected the brakes/hoses, replaced the timing belt and tensioner, new spark plug wires, new spark plugs, and gave a general tune-up. The suspension is very tight and the car stops and steers exactly as it should. The Fiat-based 1.1L motor doesn't leak, tick or smoke and will run cool all day. Its 4 speed transmission shifts flawlessly, clutch is smooth to engage and is very strong.
    All tires have great tread. The mostly original paint shows minor wear in places but still looks very nice.

    Being a California car its whole life, there isn't a single spot of rust under or on the car. The floors, bottom of doors, sills, etc. are in amazing condition. Not a single square inch of metal on this car needs replacing. This Yugo comes with the original tool kit and extra light/fuse holder, original owners manual and many spare parts, including a new timing belt, n.i.b fuel gauge, n.i.b. door handles and window cranks and left and right rear quarter glass. Aside from a painted-to-match aftermarket tachometer mounted under the dash and a nice stereo unit, the car is completely virgin and has had no other modifications. All smog equipment is present and nothing has been tampered with. Car comes with both sets of original keys as well.

    This car carries a clean California pink slip, current registration and is ready for a new home.

    The car is located at my automotive repair and restoration shop, "Bethel's Country Motors" in Loomis, California which is 20 miles East of Sacramento. Please feel free to call anytime to schedule a test drive, I guarantee you'll fall in love with this car. Call Skyler or Bruce at 1 (916) 652-6852. To the winning bidder, a deposit of $300 is due within 48 hours of the auction's end. If you have less than 50 feedbacks, please call me before placing your bid.
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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Put over 200 miles on the car so far. Another 100 miles today driving along Pacific coast between Santa Cruz and Half Moon bay. Great news! My wife absolutely loves this car. It is her favorite now. After barely taking a look at it last night she is now fully on board with the 560SEC experience. She looks forward to participating in MBCA drives and future road trips in this car. On the way back after lunch in Half Moon Bay we tried the car out as a "hardtop convertible" windows down, and full heat on, it was in the low 60s. Fantastic experience. We never turned on the radio once. Glorious day with everyone out enjoying the coast. Happy 4th of July!
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    Last edited by RicardoD; 07-04-2017 at 10:38 PM.
    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Quote Originally Posted by alabbasi View Post
    It's a nice end to the child hood dream, and now that all the money has been spent. Junior is getting a Yugo
    "Son, I'm sorry, Mercedes funds are tapped out, but a virtual friend of mine on the 500eboard found a suitable red machine for you. So we downgraded a bit from a W210 E430, but don't worry, this new car is "European" of the eastern sort, and Red, you will love the red"
    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: Owner - C126 - RicardoD - 1991 560SEC

    Oh Ricardo. . . the C126 disease continues to spread. . . welcome to the dark side.
    Last edited by Trae; 07-04-2017 at 06:47 PM.
    Trae
    1992 500E Renntech
    1993 500E
    1990 560SEC/ 2001 SL500
    1991 560SEC ECE/1995 E320 Cabriolet

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Hey Ricardo,

    I'm hyper-glad that you are the one who got that car from Robert. It's a gem, particularly for the price paid. No matter the salvage title on it, as the damage was minimal. Robert knows the car from many many years back (having serviced it for eons) and it's a very honest car. I looked at it myself many times over the past few years and came close to pulling the pin on it as a "flipper" car. I'm glad that I didn't, and that you got it as your entree' into the C126 world.

    And I'm glad you got to see Robert's stash of parts, which is so mind-boggling that I'm sure many of the folks on this forum thought I have been taking some serious drugs whenever I've described his warehouse and its contents. So, the validation is welcomed

    Anyway, as you're discovering, the C126 is a very very different beast than the E500E, and that's as it should be. It's not a sports or even sporty car, although with a few mods it can be made considerably sportier than it is in stock form. The 238-HP M117, although seemingly low on power compared to our E500Es and even modern cars, has plenty of oomph to get the SEC rolling in good order, and more importantly to cruise at high speeds all day long (or, until the fuel tank needs to be replenished, which is quite often in SECs).

    Count on about 13-15 MPG, as opposed to 16-18 MPG (typical) on the E500E. They are definitely thirstier animals.

    The main thing is to enjoy the car, and maintain and improve it where you need to. With the top-end being redone already by Robert, you're good for another 150+K of motoring on that before things have to be torn down again. You'll find that SECs are pretty easy to work on, and you have a fair bit more room underhood to get at things when you need to. There are also more quality parts on the aftermarket than with the E500E, although the same rules apply with regard to brand names and quality, etc. The SEC is a very "analog" car, with only a couple or three computers (EZL, ABS and CIS-E) which are easily found/replaced. Good idea to get spares for at least the EZL and CIS computers, but these are at wrecking yards. SEL models work just fine.

    For mods, not too much is needed other than perhaps lowering the car, maybe a set of wider wheels, and if you can find one, perhaps an aftermarket rear sway bar (check with Feind Motorsports here in TX, to see if he has any left). There are plenty of HOW-TO articles on most normal jobs that need to be done. Some of the car's systems are similar to the E500E (such as the HVAC pods). On my car, I changed the rear end from the stock 2.47 to a modified 3.06 many years ago. This increased cruising RPM by about 800 RPM, and decreased MPG by about 0.5-1 MPG, but the increased takeoff velocity is worth it. It's a bit of an extreme mod that most folks probably wouldn't do.

    I can't remember if your car was converted to R-134a or not; I assume it has been. If so, then you'll want to see how efficient it is with this refrigerant. You may be OK in the Bay Area, but I found that R-134a conversion (which Robert did on my car just before I bought it from him back in 2002) was absolutely a non-starter here in the Texas summer heat, so I converted back to R-12 about 5 years ago.

    All in all, the cars are a nice complement to each other. I tend to drive my SEC as a daily driver, and save the E500 for more when I'm in a "Sporty Spice" mood or on weekends. But for long cruises, say up to Dallas or over to Austin for a weekend trip or day-business-trip, the SEC is really a great car. Makes me look forward to those trips, actually.

    My thoughts below, in blue, to your earlier post.

    Cheers,
    Gerry



    Mechanical


    • coolant reservoir sensor (did this on my E500, should be easy to address) -- indeed, very easy. IIRC, even the same parts!!
    • alignment, should have paid for this to get outsourced by Robert, Robert did show me his alignment lift in his shop, but he still needed to get the computer hookup to make that a service he provides. Kudos to Robert for the no charge mounting and balancing of the new Michelin tires I sent his way. -- Just pay the $200 at the dealer, or go to a qualified indy. There are a few in the Bay Area that I would trust.



    Radio/Electric


    • I don't think all the speakers are working. Have to figure out where balance controls are on radio to figure this out. Hate the radio but it sounds fine to my ears. -- If original radio, fader is in the center console near the window switches. Typically the fader wheel internal contacts go bad with age. Sometimes this can be resuscitated with a little contact cleaner spray, other times a replacement is in order with a used unit. Good item to grab from wrecking yard cars, where possible. Most of them are toast. As an interim solution, just work the wheel back and forth quickly about 25 times, and this should make it provide contact for a while. Balance should be on the radio itself, again if a stock unit. Hopefully you don't have the horrible two-piece Becker 1432 unit that was used in the 1992 and 1993 500E models, and instead you have the one-piece Becker that looks similar at the head unit to the 1432. That is the Becker that I use in my 1989 560SEC and it works great, and allows the amplifiers to connect directly to the back of the radio. Also, the dual amps are located behind the rear seat-backs, rather than in the trunk as with the 500E.



    Cosmetic:


    • need a paintless dent removal person to come to my home and correct a few spots -- easy enough.
    • there are some paint blemishes, but I will categorize this as "Patina". Robert did detail the exterior, but I want to take the paint to the next level. There is a new place I discovered in Campbell that I think is up to the task. -- I lived with "patina" on my SEC (80% original paint) for 15+ years, until the accident last October at which time I had my car repainted. As long as the paint overall is good, with modest blemishes, I'd say live with it as long as you can, then pull for a repaint. Seriously, most people never see/notice any blemishes.
    • weird leather tear in the driver side passenger rear seat back, needs some Leatherique treatment in that area (rest of leather in car is gorgeous) -- May want to consider biting the bullet and getting new GAHH replacement seat cover(s). If you do, get both at the same time so that all the leather is the same color/age. You can probably have an interior place repair it, with modest results. Leatherique the hell out of the seats, particularly the rear horizontal surfaces and headrests, which take the brunt of the sun.
    • one of the lower cladding panels is lose, front passenger side, and will not properly click back into place, perhaps the mating panel side connector is damaged -- Remove this and investigate. Try to get new clips for this and see if that works, unless cladding is damaged. If damaged, you can get replacement through certain forum members, or via eBay. Or via that community of bad-boys and tough-guys over at the Banzworld 126 forum.
    • interior carpet pulling loose on passenger side entry and a bit dirty (needs some shampoo) -- have the interior detailed, and you should be able to pop off the door sill panel and glue/affix the carpet so that it is stock appearance again.
    • rear center mount stop light seal is off, need to figure out how to fix this, and clean up area -- CAREFUL in pulling this off, as the lamp housing gets sun-baked and exceedingly brittle. You may be able to fix it, or adapt a rubber seal or an o-ring from another application to it. AGAIN, CAREFUL/CAUTION here.
    • I need a new headliner if I can get the original material/color. -- Recommend interior shop do this work. I had mine done for $600 as original fabric, about 5 years ago.
    • blue paint around Mercedes logo is faded, this bothers me, since there is no star on the car, this should be perfect -- Get a new aluminum hood emblem. This is a 107 part number and DO NOT let any dealer or anyone else tell you that the plastic emblem (which is for SLKs and other models) is the "correct" one for this application. While you're at it, get a new plastic ferrule for it that it presses into. Check the EPC for part numbers.
    • oh, and cocomats, definitely need cocomats -- de rigeur. Just had a set of tan ones made about 18 months ago for my own SEC. Get a full set with the rears, too. The factory mats totally suck and are NOT worth the money. They bunch up and are flimsy/brittle as compared to the original mats from "back in the day." I've saved my original factory mats, for posterity.

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    I want to add to this re the rear sway bar: I can get you one that is the third production run for a 19mm Helwig off banzworld as a few bought but cannot use. @GVZ getting a hold of Brandon at Fiend is not so easy perhaps you can call? Also reproduction skid plates are available (I have one from MB) if you are interested. LMK (this is for anyone with a WC126)
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Thanks for the kind words Gerry. I am fine just keeping the car stock. I don't feel the need at all to make it sportier. That's what the E500 and Porsches are for. Just want to do the small jobs to take the car to the next level cosmetically and sort out the electronics. Louis already sent me a very detailed PM, with a series of preventative maintenance lubrication to go through.

    • I need a new headliner if I can get the original material/color. -- Recommend interior shop do this work. I had mine done for $600 as original fabric, about 5 years ago.
    Do you have a pointer to the original fabric? still trying to find a shop I would trust locally to me in bay area.

    The data card on my car says: 264A DATE LEATHER - SAFRAN / JAVA for interior

    I read that as part number A 126 690 36 50- 8320 in EPC. $700 at mboemparts but wonder if I order if its in stock. Then perhaps give the replacement a shot myself.




    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Quote Originally Posted by RicardoD View Post
    Do you have a pointer to the original fabric? still trying to find a shop I would trust locally to me in bay area.

    The data card on my car says: 264A DATE LEATHER - SAFRAN / JAVA for interior
    At the risk of starting a mushroom war... this color (code xx4) is generally referred to as "Palomino" in USA and North America terms. I believe it was "Date" in Europe. AFAIK, the names Saffron/Java did not exist until the mid/late 1990's and are not period-correct for any 126 chassis.


    Quote Originally Posted by RicardoD View Post
    I read that as part number A 126 690 36 50- 8320 in EPC. $700 at mboemparts but wonder if I order if its in stock. Then perhaps give the replacement a shot myself.
    Only way to check inventory is to contact a dealer and have them look it up in Paragon. Or, you can place an order and wait to see if it's cancelled...


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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Quote Originally Posted by gsxr View Post
    At the risk of starting a mushroom war... this color (code xx4) is generally referred to as "Palomino" in USA and North America terms. I believe it was "Date" in Europe. AFAIK, the names Saffron/Java did not exist until the mid/late 1990's and are not period-correct for any 126 chassis.
    I blame the Ukraine website where I pulled my datacard info for my VIN.
    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    If I was to replace the headline (which I have to) on the 560SEC, it would be in alcantera like material. I have this material in the headliner on my SL55 and it's bloody lovely.

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    I have a spare headliner for the C126, but its not a wear item, just the fabric they used falling off the form fitted fabric form they attach it to. It was NLA in 2012 in grey so I just had shop recover it and the slider for the sunroof for $350. Still spending your money here, but here goes. When you or the shop drops the headliner (15 minute job tops), if you have some dynomat or similar brand stuff, consider covering your roof with it, or at a minimum the metal slide plate. Anything to help keep the heat away is a good thing.

    Also inspect the corners of the sunroof capsule for rust, blockages in the drain tubes. I have found broken or cracked rubber drains attached to the rusted out steel drain tubes on junkyard cars. Mine had a tear in the tube at the A pillar, letting water run down onto the footwell. Carefully pour some water in the open sunroof corners, making sure it drains to the ground quickly. The other test is at the base of the windscreen - a common drain plugging area and great source of rusting on all of the CW126
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Quote Originally Posted by gsxr View Post
    At the risk of starting a mushroom war... this color (code xx4) is generally referred to as "Palomino" in USA and North America terms. I believe it was "Date" in Europe. AFAIK, the names Saffron/Java did not exist until the mid/late 1990's and are not period-correct for any 126 chassis.
    Dave and official MB interior color names have a very strange relationship. So one must take Dave's musings on MB interior colors, well, with a grain of salt.

    Quote Originally Posted by RicardoD View Post
    I blame the Ukraine website where I pulled my datacard info for my VIN.
    Generally speaking, Palomino is the accepted color name, as Dave mentioned. But Date is just fine, and nobody (except Dave) will slap your hand for saying Java, or Date.

    Quote Originally Posted by alabbasi View Post
    If I was to replace the headline (which I have to) on the 560SEC, it would be in alcantera like material. I have this material in the headliner on my SL55 and it's bloody lovely.
    Any good interior shop that knows Benzes will have, or have full access to, alcantara-type material in the appropriate color(s). Seriously, I'd have a quality interior shop re-do your headliner, rather than trying to do it yourself.

    Working with my interior shop owner, I looked at alcantara for my SEC and E500 headliners, but decided to go with "stock" color and style headliner materials as I felt alcantara was too much "bling" for a car of the vintage of mine. For a more modern car, I think alcantara is more appropriate. YMMV / others have their opinions ... there is no "right" or "wrong" here, just personal taste.

    (There is no right or wrong when it comes to certain mushroom/creme beige .... palomino/date color nomenclature, either!)

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Oh, I'd be fine with Date... not so much with Java though (that was a W210 / W220 thing, IIRC).

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    About 12 years ago, my SEC headliner started sagging. What happens, is that there is a surface layer of fabric that is glued to a harder, foam piece. The glue that holds the fabric to the foam piece eventually lets go, and then the fabric sags. Heat and age are the primary culprits, and all of them do this eventually.

    Once upon a time ago, there was a group of 126 coupe owners and we had a mailing list and there was a small web site (it was converted a few years back into a Google Group). One of the mailing list members did a HOW-TO on removing the fabric and re-gluing it. I did this HOW-TO, but only have very limited success. It's difficult to spray the glue to the correct thickness so that it doesn't soak through the thin fabric, and it's difficult to set everything correctly and make it look perfect.

    My HOW-TO job on the headliner lasted for about 2-3 years, and then a couple of years after moving to Texas, the heat did it the headliner in, and I just decided to have the pro's do it. And then I did same on my E500. Wasn't cheap, but it's a 100% professional job, guaranteed, and I won't have to worry about it for another 15+ years. Bonus was that I got new, unsoiled fabric covering.

    Interior/upholstery/seating work takes a lot of time, effort and talent to do correctly. Like alignments, it is one of the few jobs that I just would leave to a professional who specializes in that kind of work. Same with when I replaced the soft top on my former 560SL with a new one. I had a shop in Portland, Oregon who had been working Benz soft tops for decades do the work, and they did a perfect job.

    Cheers,
    Gerry

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    I don't want to re-do headliner myself (meaning apply fabric to a back shell) but if I can get the part out of Mercedes (fabric already on back shell) then maybe that I can install myself. Still on the hunt for a local interior shop, I know they exist just looking for a referral and someone who won't butcher the interior removing the headliner. I want to stick to stock or as close to stock fabric as possible. I am one of those keep it stock kind of guys and will probably keep this car that way. Skinny tires, tiny 15" wheels, and SUV ride height, and all. Car still looks great to my eyes. Nocfn has a good point on perhaps putting dynamat type heat shield in place to extend headliner longevity.

    Everyone has been so helpful spending my money!

    Ricardo
    RicardoD
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    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Robert may be able to help you with a referral to a South Bay or Peninsula interior shop.

    Alternately, call Roy Spencer in Burlingame, as he can definitely tell you who to go to in the area between South San Francisco and Gilroy. Roy can be reached at (650) 343-7980. He owns a used Benz dealership called LR Spencer Co. Robert knows him and we call him "Elroy" (i.e. like the son of George Jetson).

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Quick update on headliner:

    - as suspected, headliner part, A 126 690 36 50-8320 is NLA, I called MB of Napervile (mboemparts.com) to confirm
    - Roy Spencer's trusted interior restoration guy is retired!

    definitely will outsource this to a shop once I figure out which shop to use, and will try to match fabric as best I can, or perhaps someone can re-use the existing fabric, it is not torn anywhere, but deliminating in certain areas.
    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Ricardo, there is only one way to get the head liner off, it cannot be butchered. However, I would read how to remove the C pillar covers yourself and be damn sure you don't break them as they are also N-L-A. You wont be able to remove the seatbelt from them unless you do other things, but removing the C pillar yourself and with the help of one of your young helpers, pull the seatbelts to the center of the window. You can loosely zip tie the two seat belts together with the C-pillars safely on the parcel shelf. You may want to remove the metal clips so they don't get lost.
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Quote Originally Posted by nocfn View Post
    Ricardo, there is only one way to get the head liner off, it cannot be butchered. However, I would read how to remove the C pillar covers yourself and be damn sure you don't break them as they are also N-L-A. You wont be able to remove the seatbelt from them unless you do other things, but removing the C pillar yourself and with the help of one of your young helpers, pull the seatbelts to the center of the window. You can loosely zip tie the two seat belts together with the C-pillars safely on the parcel shelf. You may want to remove the metal clips so they don't get lost.
    Indeed, the C-pillar covers have tabs and slots that are EXTREMELY fragile and can break quite easily. In fact, most of mine have been broken off, and it makes the covers fit poorly. Fortunately, I was able last summer (2016) to get a pair of unmolested "mushroom" () C-pillar covers from a coupe at the van de Velde wrecking yard in Belgium, and am holding them in reserve for a near-future replacement.

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Been using the 90' SEC for a daily driver for the last 2.5 years.
    Great long haul cruiser.
    Trae
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    1990 560SEC/ 2001 SL500
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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Trying to get the car ready as quickly as I can for Legends of the Autobahn. First step is paintless dent removal on fender and a couple of passenger side door dings. Then on to headliner. Here is the before, door dings didn't photograph but they are there. Maybe one on the trunk as well. Can only tell in right light. Guy is coming on Tuesday to handle a couple of my cars and take care of my neighbor as well.
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    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    I figured out my lower cladding issue. The back side plastic "rails" of the cladding is broken so it can't engage the clip. Lucky for me I found new old stock of the part on eBay and its on its way to my house. Looking at EPC and some google searching this appears to be a common part with the sedans. So Gerry was right in telling me some parts are easier to get. Thankfully the eBay part was the right side and ridiculously cheap vs my expectation. I think I will get new clips on both cladding and body side for a proper repair.

    A0019883481 qty 3 buttons
    A0059889778 qty 3 clips
    A1266905640 I need Right side and Alto Gray color I believe, which is 7700 in EPC (found on eBay, thank you baby jebus)

    Anything else I am missing?
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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    I have a complete set of clips when I finally get around to going 199 monochromatic on the cladding. Good Idea to wax under there before placing that cladding back on.
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Getting into my deferred maintenance items via local inspection at Circle Star Motors followed by an alignment. Thankfully not the usual $5 to $10k on these cars as anticipated. Just took one level up in handling and refinement. Car felt great before now its even more fun to drive.

    7/26/2017 Circle Star Motors Santa Cruz, CA (@90k odometer miles)
    • 126 330 03 03 left tie rod R&R
    • 11663330927 left lower ball joint R&R
    • 123 320 09 89 both rear sway bar links R&R
    • 123 241 30 13 both engine mounts R&R (slight vibration through gas pedal is now nearly gone, as in the Chicago car I drove a week back)
    • Alignment and correct tire pressure 28lbs front 32 lbs rear , 65% of front brake pads remaining, 25% of rear pads remaining

    I will have to leave the joy of ball joint replacement by myself for next time. Happy to let my local shop take car of this stuff for now.

    7/19/2017 Deluxe Dent Paintless Dent Removal

    • 2 passenger side door dings and 2 trunk lid dings removed


    7/10/2017

    • 1991 560sec owner manual via eBay
    • 1991 560sec First Aid kit via eBay (I swear I think I bought the original kit from my car, somebody from San Francisco)
    • Covercraft Ultra'tect cover
    • Covercraft custom sunscreen for 560sec
    Last edited by RicardoD; 07-27-2017 at 11:01 PM.
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    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    In a previous post I mentioned a bought a New Old Stock passenger side front cladding for my car via eBay. Well its the wrong color! I was fooled by the eBay ad photography, and conspicuous lack of back side photo, and no mention of paint code in the ad. Thought I was buying an Alto Gray but instead I am now the proud owner of a Lake Green (Lago Grun) cladding.

    So if you own a Teal Blue Paint Code 888 W126, and need right side front cladding in 6250 Lago Grun have I got a deal for you!! I am going to repair my lower cladding piece which is what I should have done in the first place. I will post about that when that job is done.

    eBay photo vs correct color correct photo attached.
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    Last edited by RicardoD; 07-28-2017 at 01:11 AM.
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    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Why not just get it painted, or buy the paint and do it yourself, R?


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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    It's a pretty straight forward epoxy repair on my current panel which is very clean.

    Not sure I trust my painting skills, is aldo gray available in a rattl can?
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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    MB doesn't sell the paint anymore, but check with Tom Hanson, they may have the small spray cans set grey/clear for those.

    Paintscratch.com is a bit spendy, but the custom color is spot on, I have used it many times.
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Ricardo,

    Parts picture #11 looks like a new mounting bar can't you just remove the old bar and replace the bar? Maybe not that simple? Just curious about that.

    One thing I know that the PO sure was a sloppy repair person with that big glob of glue showing there.
    Terry

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Part #11 is the chrome piece I believe which comes with the cladding. The previous repair was such that it held the new clip in the perfect position and then I just encapsulated it in epoxy after degreasing the area. Here is a zoomed out photo.

    Thanks for the tip Louis on the paint, if this repair doesn't work I will go down that road.
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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Quote Originally Posted by RicardoD View Post
    Part #11 is the chrome piece I believe which comes with the cladding.
    My mistake. Without the parts list it looked more like the mounting bar to me.

    Hope your repair works out OK. If not looks like the green part is practically brand new.
    Terry

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    I have purchased rattle cans of the Alto Gray paint in the past and they have worked very well. I've used them for the jack hole covers for the 124 and 126. They are not hugely expensive and are nice to have around for small repairs and such.

    Otherwise, just have a qualified MB-capable body/paint shop paint the cladding for you.

    If you don't want to keep the cladding, Ricardo, I will be very happy to buy it from you.

    Cheers,
    Gerry

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    How much cladding have you bout over the past 6 months GVZ.... Lets hope you never need it again.
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Quote Originally Posted by nocfn View Post
    How much cladding have you bout over the past 6 months GVZ.... Lets hope you never need it again.
    One can never have enough cladding .... or C126 parts in their parts stock.

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    My cladding repair worked! but upon closer inspection in that area there is clear sign of a respray. #1, the old panel buttons where spray painted over black and their is overspray in the lower rocket panel cladding area. So i do need to correct that. I think left front fender may have been replaced.

    7/28/2017 @90k miles
    A0019883481 qty 3 buttons
    A0059889778 qty 3 clips
    epoxy repair of right side front cladding clip

    Now on to the headliner, front emblem, carpet cleaning and cocomats!

    Last edited by RicardoD; 07-29-2017 at 09:17 AM.
    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    On the C126, there is a vin tag on the inner fender lip near the hinge, toward the last few bolts. If it is painted over or not there, that is your confirmation.
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Thanks Louis, no VIN tag on right front fender. Mystery solved. Paintscratch.com has a plastic spray kit. Wonder if it will "buff out"
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    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Ricardo,

    I think you should be able to take that black paint off with a light rubbing compound.
    Just be very careful and concentrate on the solid black area and work out to the edges.
    In fact I would mask off the alto grey to ensure you are not removing it with the compound.

    It will take a while and a lot of patience but I think it's worth a try before you have to paint over it.
    What's to lose?

    Anyway glad your repair worked out. You might want to hang on to the green panel until your sure your fix is permanent.
    You know you already have a "FISH" on the line when your tired of it taking up space in the garage.
    Terry

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Quote Originally Posted by TerryA View Post
    You know you already have a "FISH" on the line when your tired of it taking up space in the garage.

    Woa! There are some very good examples between you and San Diego.....
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    8/12/2017 @90k miles

    a little cosmetic cleanup on the headlights, got new wiper arms and blades. You can repaint the wiper arms but at $22 each I just bought new.

    126-820-70-44 wiper arm one side
    126-820-69-44 wiper arm other side
    126-820-12-45 qty 2 blades

    Little 8mm bolt to replace each. Right side blade looked newer, with holographic sticker, and has a green stripe on the washer tube, my right was older stock and did not have this green stripe. Losing points at my next Concours.



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    Last edited by RicardoD; 08-20-2017 at 06:42 PM.
    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Nice buy, I'd like to see if I can find the Euro ones like on my car which are cracked.

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    Captains log....

    8/20/2017 @ ~90k miles
    - thanks to Louis I lubed up the 560SEC
    - Gleitpaste on the sunroof rails and door latches
    - ATF on hood & trunk hinges, throttle linkage
    - polishing compound took care of the overspray on the right side lower cladding, took about 15 minutes of rubbing, looks 1000 times better
    - speaker issues just turned out to be crudded up fader control, moving it back and forth a bit, got the front left working again. Now all speakers sound like shit equally.
    - lubed up the door hinges with my chainsaw grease gun

    I think I will send in my Becker radio to get the bluetooth added and see what I can figure out about replacing the speakers. I intend to use the 560 for weekend getaway trips so need to get the audio upgraded as best I can but staying with stock wiring and head unit.
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    RicardoD
    1990 964 C4 / 1991 964 C2 tip
    1994 E500
    1991 560SEC
    2014 E350 for wife

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    Re: OWNER - RicardoD (1991 560SEC)

    You forgot the Stardate in your Captain's Log.

    4:40 PM PDT this afternoon would equate to Stardate 95237.73


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