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Thread: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

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    C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    This is in the August 2017 print issue of Car & Driver:

    http://www.caranddriver.com/features...e-test-feature

    The new Continental ExtremeContact Sport (which replaces the now-NLA Conti DW) did very well, placing second behind the Michelin Pilot Sport 4 S, with the Conti having a noticeable advantage in the wet.

    Shame that none of these are available in 225-55-16 size for stock E500E wheels. For that matter, no major name-brand mfr offers "summer" performance tires in that size; only all-season tires. Conti DW was the last I knew of and it went the way of the dodo early this year.

    Dave M.
    1997 E420 (Bugeyes)
    1994 E420 (Blondie)
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    1992 500E (Mach 5)
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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Thanks Dave! A quick check of prices and it seems that the ExtremeContact Sports are more expensive than the DW used to be...
    Greg
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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    I’m currently in need of new tires and have decided to keep the stock 16” wheels for now... Need all-season as it’s rainy up here in the PNW. Suggestions are welcomed.

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    It's tough to beat a good set of Michelins on an MB. What was Forrest Gump's expression about peas and carrots?.......well in my book that's how Michelins and MB's are.........

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    IMOP, Michelin is still the best hands down. I'm really happy w/ my latest set of Michelins in sizes 245 & 275 x 18.
    They are wearing well still stick great and most of all they are QUIET.

    Although the new Conti is quite capable and is definitely a good choice for less money.

    Either would do nicely on an E500E and for probably 95% of us owners we will never come close to either tires limits on the street.

    I know there are a few of us that will try to wring out every last bit of performance possible but most don't.

    Just my $0.02
    Terry

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    C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    IIRC, Primacy 16 are Klink’s favorite.
    1994 E500
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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    I run Primacy HP on the 034, MO stamped. They are a sweet combination of quietness, wet handling, grip and durability. Very happy with them.
    Thomas
    1994 E420
    1993 500E - (my fathers)

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Primacy HP appears to be a very good tire, although it's considered a "summer touring" tire ($175 on closeout sale):
    https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...um=255YR6PHPXL

    Oddly, despite good performance ratings, it has a poor "would recommend" rating:
    https://www.tirerack.com/tires/surve...ay.jsp?type=GT


    For an "all-season" tire I'd look at the Conti DWS 06 ($126):
    https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...um=255WR6DWS06

    On a tighter budget for all-seasons, the General G-MAX AS-05 looks decent ($85) and the 225/55 size is made in Germany... IIRC General is related to Conti?
    https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...m=255WR6GMAS05


    In Portland, since you aren't likely to ever see snow or ice, the Primacy HP should be fine - it just ain't cheap!

    Dave M.
    1997 E420 (Bugeyes)
    1994 E420 (Blondie)
    1994 E500 (Q-ship)
    1992 500E (Mach 5)
    1987 300D (Sportline Stage 2)
    Click here for my website
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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Yeah Primacy HP is not considered a sticky tire in that sense tbh, but for me it's a great allrounder. I had the Pilot Sports before these, and they wore faster and was not as good as the HPs in the wet, which matters to me here in rainy Sweden. Grip levels feels about the same for normal inspired driving.
    Thomas
    1994 E420
    1993 500E - (my fathers)

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Just to clear up some possible confusion, unless you will be driving in snow, you have absolutely ZERO "need" whatsoever for a "all season" or "M+S" tire. Even low temperature is not an issue, as all the way down to freezing, and probably even for considerably below freezing temperatures, the "summer" tire will outperform the "all season" in just about every performance oriented driving style parameter, including wet grip and hydroplaning resistance. The only performance oriented exceptions to what I've just said are the track oriented "DOT race" tires, which sacrifice hydroplaning resistance and low temperature performance for their track capabilities.

    Regarding who owns who, General is Continental, and BF Godrich is Michelin. Uniroyal is also Michelin, at least in the USA. And yes, as you might expect, the performance offerings from these companies do look and drive like the parent companies' recently discontinued offerings. I am talking about sidewall cutaways, and how they feel to the flexing hand (yes, I know, that's like a tire "butt dyno", but I'm telling you, mine is just about infallible), and their driving characteristics, not the tread designs, which are often considerably different than the premium branded originals.

    The two BFG's in that size would be a good bet, especially the "summer" version. I absolutely love the Primacy HP, and it is the one I would actually spend my own money on, at least possibly until now, but yes, they are pricey, and to make matters worse, it looks like they are also about to go obsolete, so you could be finding yourself in a bad state if you need to replace a damage tire. There are a number of excellent summer performance tires available in Europe, including replacements for the Primacy HP, unfortunately, it does not look like any of the companies are likely to import those to the states.
    Putting the fun in dysfunction...

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Snow tires are for snow/ice/real winter with freezing temps, nothing else. Also these so called "all weather" tires (at least the ones sold in Europe) are proven in test after test to be bad in almost all conditions.

    I went to Norway with Pilot Sports on the 034 in April of '13, I had well below freezing temps (-15 C) on several occasions, but on dry tarmac. No problems at all.
    Thomas
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    1993 500E - (my fathers)

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Quote Originally Posted by Klink View Post
    ... I absolutely love the Primacy HP, and it is the one I would actually spend my own money on, at least possibly until now, but yes, they are pricey, and to make matters worse, it looks like they are also about to go obsolete, so you could be finding yourself in a bad state if you need to replace a damage tire. .
    "IIRC, Primacy 16 are Klink’s favorite." I left off the HP, but I was close!!!
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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Quote Originally Posted by doolar View Post
    Snow tires are for snow/ice/real winter with freezing temps, nothing else.
    100% correct. Hopefully not many people are using their E500E in snow.


    Quote Originally Posted by doolar View Post
    Also these so called "all weather" tires (at least the ones sold in Europe) are proven in test after test to be bad in almost all conditions.
    In the USA a lot of people think "all season" means four seasons, including snow & ice, which is not accurate. They're really 3-season and should be replaced with true winter tires if you drive on snow & ice. Click below for an article from Popular Mechanics in 2011 titled "The Myth of the All-Season Tire". All-seasons are definitely a compromise.

    Attached Files Attached Files

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Closer in toward Wash DC, people seem to think they can get away with Summer tires year round. It snows here. There's ice. And sleet. Winter weather causes biblical-grade chaos and destruction. Nobody learns. Ever.

    Either they don't know any better, or they are under the impression they drive beyond 2 or 3/10ths on their commute. lol

    I would prefer that the average driver used All Season's instead of the Summer tires their BMW/Merc/Nissan/whatever came with from the factory.

    My wife's Panamera has "All Seasons" of the 20" steam-roller-width variety, first Pirelli P7 Cinturato and now Michelin PS A/S+. I've never seen more Dry/Summer biased All Season tires in my life. She has other options to drive when the weather is crappy, but it's nice to think/know/hope these tires COULD possibly get her home if the weather turns unexpected.

    I love talking tires.
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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Snow is just frozen water, right? If they didn't put salt on the roads here, I'd love to take the E420 out when new snow's fallen. Probably a very fun car in the snow!
    Thomas
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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Quote Originally Posted by ace10 View Post
    Closer in toward Wash DC, people seem to think they can get away with Summer tires year round. It snows here. There's ice. And sleet. Winter weather causes biblical-grade chaos and destruction. Nobody learns. Ever.

    Either they don't know any better, or they are under the impression they drive beyond 2 or 3/10ths on their commute. lol

    I would prefer that the average driver used All Season's instead of the Summer tires their BMW/Merc/Nissan/whatever came with from the factory.

    My wife's Panamera has "All Seasons" of the 20" steam-roller-width variety, first Pirelli P7 Cinturato and now Michelin PS A/S+. I've never seen more Dry/Summer biased All Season tires in my life. She has other options to drive when the weather is crappy, but it's nice to think/know/hope these tires COULD possibly get her home if the weather turns unexpected.

    I love talking tires.
    Sounds about what we have in the south of Sweden. There's a law here that demands M+S marked tires between December 1st and March 31st, if there's winter road conditions. The law's a bit vague here, but if there's snow or ice on the road surface, you have to have M+S tires. So basically everybody swaps tires in November. It actually helps, this law, even though you can't legislate against stupidity and ignorance. Some people just don't care about the tire regulations, all people seems to forget that we get winter every year.

    When I was a kid there where neither a law on this, or snow tires for that matter. It was actually sort of a sport not to end up in the ditch each season, because everybody did at some time or another. We had snow chains of course, but you only break out those after you're stuck or had a mishap.

    Anyway, I think that's why the all-season tires got so much flak here. They are just never really suited for our conditions.
    Thomas
    1994 E420
    1993 500E - (my fathers)

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    M+S tires are a joke... that rating means almost nothing. Mostly just means the tire is not a racing slick and has some grooves in it, somewhere.

    True snow tires have a "snowflake on the mountain" symbol. A tire without this marking is just another all-season.


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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    I'm running Monoblocks staggered.
    When I go to Tire Rack for summer tires in those sizes on my car, they don't list any Michelins other than run flats???
    I don't want no stinking run-flats!
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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Quote Originally Posted by gsxr View Post
    M+S tires are a joke... that rating means almost nothing. Mostly just means the tire is not a racing slick and has some grooves in it, somewhere.

    True snow tires have a "snowflake on the mountain" symbol. A tire without this marking is just another all-season.

    Absolutely true Gixxer. M+S can mean anything really (the "S" can stand for "sand" I.E.), so you'll have to check for your self that it really is a winter tire. We have STRO (The Scandinavian Tire and Rim Organization) that makes a list of all tires that are approved and legal as a winter tire in Sweden. Here's their list for 2017.

    But mainly, if you buy a M+S tire in Sweden, it will be a proper winter tire.
    Thomas
    1994 E420
    1993 500E - (my fathers)

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    Quote Originally Posted by ace10 View Post
    Closer in toward Wash DC, people seem to think they can get away with Summer tires year round. It snows here. There's ice. And sleet. Winter weather causes biblical-grade chaos and destruction. Nobody learns. Ever.

    Either they don't know any better, or they are under the impression they drive beyond 2 or 3/10ths on their commute. lol

    I would prefer that the average driver used All Season's instead of the Summer tires their BMW/Merc/Nissan/whatever came with from the factory.

    My wife's Panamera has "All Seasons" of the 20" steam-roller-width variety, first Pirelli P7 Cinturato and now Michelin PS A/S+. I've never seen more Dry/Summer biased All Season tires in my life. She has other options to drive when the weather is crappy, but it's nice to think/know/hope these tires COULD possibly get her home if the weather turns unexpected.

    I love talking tires.
    So true! Despite my personal dislike of them, I have all season tires on our daily drivers because they CAN get caught in the occasional freak snowstorm or icing that we have here in the south US, and in those conditions, some dedicated summer performance tires feel like driving on marbles.
    Putting the fun in dysfunction...

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    Re: C&D Aug-2017: Gumshoes: Five Sticky Summer Performance Tires Tested

    +1 to this^^^… this plus the fact that I never ever EVER outdrive the all season tires; in even the hottest, driest weather…

    Ultra High Performance All Season beats anything I’ll do in the car. Hell, Grandma Performance All Season might do it, since typically there’s someone’s grandma in the car…

    ;-D

    maw

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