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Thread: Drive (Axle) shafts for differential

  1. #1
    E500E Guru Taxi Driver's Avatar
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    Drive (Axle) shafts for differential

    As this has been quite a wide topic, hosted by Owner Doolar, I Think it would be time to lift this topic, Rear End
    and what to use for performance enhancements.

    I would like some input and knowlege about the differences. First what I found out about the drive shafts, there are
    at least two shafts for the fitment on our 036 and 034, also there are shafts from the R129 variety wich apparently
    will fit the V8 124's. Same length they are and does fit for Exchange/repair.

    As you who have followed Doolar, know he broke/twisted one shaft on his E420! non ASR but only 280hp.
    The shaft that Went "South" was the type with a 25mm dia. the 036 has the 32mm shaft and ASR, I do not
    know what was available for the 500SL.

    As i seems, the SL500 or SL600 later ones, I do not know when that happened, I have seen both SL60, SL600 and SL500
    with the 25mm!!! shaft. I find that a bit strange, did MB trust the ASR or the ESP to do the "job" saving the shafts
    and tyres?

    I would also like some input on the differential, interchangability and strengthwise too.

    I hope to have delivered soon '92 500SL drive shafts, I am about to rebuild the 400E rear end and by that
    change to the 32mm shafts, I do not trust the OEM 25mm's to take the thrust from the W210 072 E50 motor.

    I will be back when this and more knowlege comes up.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    '92 500E 6.0 AMG
    '93 400E 5.0 AMG
    '96 E50 AMG
    '96 CL500
    '99 C43 AMG

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    .036 Hoonigan™
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    Re: Drive shafts Differential

    I can help a little bit. Or maybe just add to the confusion.

    The early R129 500SL (129.066) used the same axles as the M104-powered 124's (.032/.052/.066/.092); 129-350-38-10 without ASR, and 129-350-41-10 with ASR. These use the corresponding differential flanges (129-350-08-45 without ASR, 129-350-09-45 with ASR). These are all different than the 124.034/.036 parts.

    The later R129 SL500 (129.067) uses mostly all different part numbers, however it does share the same inner CV joint (126-350-01-13) as the .034/.036, except for very very late 124 builds (after C241287).

    I'm still not sure about part interchanges (specifically, axle shafts) or diameters on the 129.067 and the 124. The axle shafts specified for the 129.067 chassis were also used on the 129.076 (M120 / V12).

    Interestingly, as noted in the other thread, the W210 E50/E60 used smaller CV joints (same as the 210.072 with 4.2L engine) and smaller 25mm diameter axles. And, these are the standard axles used on the 6-cyl 124 chassis!

    The W210 did not get upgraded rear axles until the entire rear differential was upgraded from the 210mm to either the 198mm or 215mm W220 diff (I forget which size those are). This happened at the 210 chassis A604351, or somewhere in 1998-99 model year production.

    Dave M.
    1997 E420 (Bugeyes)
    1994 E420 (Blondie)
    1994 E500 (Q-ship)
    1992 500E (Mach 5)
    1987 300D (Sportline Stage 2)
    Click here for my website
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    Re: Drive shafts Differential

    We've seen through the years a few failure- they are all northern cars where rust was a contributor to start fatigue cracking. Remember- those 7.4 V12 and 6.0 liter are pushing through the same ASR axles.
    I think only a few racers have upgraded- I want to say our CV's are M27? I'm not sure it's stricktly shaft diameter- but what are they rated for?



    Michael

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    Re: Drive shafts Differential

    Quote Originally Posted by Taxi Driver View Post
    As this has been quite a wide topic, hosted by Owner Doolar, I Think it would be time to lift this topic, Rear End
    and what to use for performance enhancements.

    I would like some input and knowlege about the differences. First what I found out about the drive shafts, there are
    at least two shafts for the fitment on our 036 and 034, also there are shafts from the R129 variety wich apparently
    will fit the V8 124's. Same length they are and does fit for Exchange/repair.

    As you who have followed Doolar, know he broke/twisted one shaft on his E420! non ASR but only 280hp.
    The shaft that Went "South" was the type with a 25mm dia. the 036 has the 32mm shaft and ASR, I do not
    know what was available for the 500SL.

    As i seems, the SL500 or SL600 later ones, I do not know when that happened, I have seen both SL60, SL600 and SL500
    with the 25mm!!! shaft.
    I find that a bit strange, did MB trust the ASR or the ESP to do the "job" saving the shafts
    and tyres?

    I would also like some input on the differential, interchangability and strengthwise too.

    I hope to have delivered soon '92 500SL drive shafts, I am about to rebuild the 400E rear end and by that
    change to the 32mm shafts, I do not trust the OEM 25mm's to take the thrust from the W210 072 E50 motor.

    I will be back when this and more knowlege comes up.
    I found the same what you wrote in bold Roger. Actually most of the V12 cars I found at the Swedish online breakers (www.bildelsbasen.se) had the 25mm ones. Among the other 1992 - 1994 axles it was a mixed bag, seemed completely random and not related to ASR/non-ASR.

    The one I got is 99% (I checked VIN and datacard, plus got confirmation from the breaker yard) confirmed coming from a non-ASR car, and it was still a 32mm one. That shaft came from a 1992 or 1993 (don't remember right now, but can check) SL 500. It was a perfect fit to my .034. Hence I'll be sure to get one more of that shaft for the other side.

    Where is the p/n stamped on the shaft? I want to look at my axle to get the part number, so I can confirm a known 32mm p/n that works on our cars, or I should say works 100% on a .034 non-ASR car, which brings me on to the next topic;

    Do ASR/non-ASR matter, or are the axles the same, maybe apart from the thickness of the shaft? If so, there's a bunch of more replacement shaft for you .036 owners down the line, since all you have to do is to find a 32mm shaft from a SL 500, of which there should be plenty around at the breakers worldwide.

    Or am I making it to easy (or complicated) here?
    Thomas
    1994 E420
    1993 500E - (my fathers)

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  9. #5
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    Re: Drive shafts Differential

    Quote Originally Posted by samiam44 View Post
    We've seen through the years a few failure- they are all northern cars where rust was a contributor to start fatigue cracking. Remember- those 7.4 V12 and 6.0 liter are pushing through the same ASR axles.
    I think only a few racers have upgraded- I want to say our CV's are M27? I'm not sure it's stricktly shaft diameter- but what are they rated for?



    Michael
    In Sweden it's not an uncommon failure, even on the four- and six-pot cars. The axles endured salt and winter over the years and miles, and the salt creeps in between the boot rim and the axle, and start the corrosion process.
    Thomas
    1994 E420
    1993 500E - (my fathers)

  10. #6
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    Re: Drive shafts Differential

    "In Sweden it's not an uncommon failure, even on the four- and six-pot cars. The axles endured salt and winter over the years and miles, and the salt creeps in between the boot rim and the axle, and start the corrosion process"
    You could prevent that on clean boots. On Aerospace, things that see a salt-water environment. Everything gets fillet and surface fay sealing. The most common sealant meeting MIL-PFR-8802 specification. A pint kit is $25 from a local suppliers(got to be a source on every airfield). Most places throw it away every year to keep the stock fresh for safety reasons. If you know a A & P, you can get some expired(but good material) for free.

    We usually just mix up just enough with using tongue depressors to pull it out of the can. Think it's a 10:1 mix, but you want a dark grey color. Get some on (mask the axle for a clean line), pull the tape off and use your finger covered in liquid soap to smooth it out. Make sure the paint a rubber is clean first with Isoproyl Alcohol.
    You want a nice fillet between the boot end and axle.

    I'm in North Texas so we are pretty much rust-free unless it is a northern car junked here... Haven't seen an inrush of Houston hurricane cars yet either.

    Be happy to add explanation or a picture if you need it.

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  12. #7
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    Re: Drive (Axle) shafts for differential

    About the ABS pickup ring (ASR) too, to move the pickup sensors to the outer axle joint, the ABS ring wich
    is pressed onto the CVJ and by using the later Wheel Carriers w the magnetic pickup mounted in there.

    The pickup ring does have 48 holes, the front hubs, this from the 400E does have 96 serrations for the pickup.

    Does this mean the pickup ring inside the ASR diff also have the 96 as the front hub?

    Last pict. '96/97 carrier w 300mm disc.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    '92 500E 6.0 AMG
    '93 400E 5.0 AMG
    '96 E50 AMG
    '96 CL500
    '99 C43 AMG

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    .036 Hoonigan™
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    Re: Drive (Axle) shafts for differential

    Quote Originally Posted by Taxi Driver View Post
    About the ABS pickup ring (ASR) too, to move the pickup sensors to the outer axle joint, the ABS ring wich
    is pressed onto the CVJ and by using the later Wheel Carriers w the magnetic pickup mounted in there.

    The pickup ring does have 48 holes, the front hubs, this from the 400E does have 96 serrations for the pickup.

    Does this mean the pickup ring inside the ASR diff also have the 96 as the front hub?
    No, the diff pickup ring (part of the axle flanges / stub shaft) is not a fine-tooth like the front. It looks very similar to the pickup ring you show with 48 holes, however I don't know the exact count, as I don't have an ASR diff handy to take apart.

    Anyone have an ASR diff from 124 floating around that could pop out the flanges and count the 'teeth'? If the count is the same, that would be awesome.


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    Re: Drive (Axle) shafts for differential

    "If the count is the same, that would be awesome."
    Yeah that would be the day.... I Think the time has come, to get rid of the ASR diff and the World of DIFFerent ones
    will open up, how nice that would be for us who want to play around....

    Should we assume the 036 front hub is the same as the 400 one, none ASR car???
    '92 500E 6.0 AMG
    '93 400E 5.0 AMG
    '96 E50 AMG
    '96 CL500
    '99 C43 AMG

  15. #10
    .036 Hoonigan™
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    Re: Drive (Axle) shafts for differential

    Quote Originally Posted by Taxi Driver View Post
    "If the count is the same, that would be awesome."
    Yeah that would be the day.... I Think the time has come, to get rid of the ASR diff and the World of DIFFerent ones
    will open up, how nice that would be for us who want to play around....

    Should we assume the 036 front hub is the same as the 400 one, none ASR car???
    Yes, the front hubs (129-330-04-25) are the same for all 124.034/.036 and .06x cabrio, and also R129 through 1995.


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