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Thread: W202 C36 AMG....

  1. #1
    I do believe...! Christian_K's Avatar
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    W202 C36 AMG....

    Hi i want to buy in 1-2 weeks a Mercedes C36 AMG, until my broken 500E is ready again (could take 1-2 Months in total), so i can drive to work on my own finally and additionally to have a nice powerful winter-car, since i decided to NOT drive my beloved 500E in the salty and very cold snowy winters here in germany.

    From what i know: The C36 AMG has 280HP (DIN) and 385NM Torque rating on roughly "just" 1500kg in total weight, 0-62mph is 6.7seconds, V-max is around 270kph.
    Compared to W124 E420: 279HP - 400NM Torque - ~1780kg weight - 0-62 6.8-7.0 seconds - V-max 250kph.
    Fuel economy is roughly around 20mpg, some people claim up to 25mpg on long slow highway trips.

    Since it has gone rid of the old shitty EZL Ignition, Ignition timings can be adjusted and are successfully adjusted by many "chip-tuners" in combination with fuel-maps here in germany, to produce more power with high Octane Fuels. A guy in a german Forum claimed to have made 306HP and 437NM of Torque (DIN) on a dyno after Chip-tuning

    Its a M104 with HFM injection, right? Or is it already Bosch ME in the C-class? I'm looking to buy one of 12/1995. I've heard that some of the issues are very very similar to M119s like ASR/Limp-Home issues related to failed Throttle-Bodies and so forth.

    Does anyone has any Info on it? Is the car "good" or reliable?
    Christian K.
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    09/1989 300E - DB172 Anthrazitgrau-Metallic
    11/1998 E430 - DB339 Violan-Metallic
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Quote Originally Posted by Christian_K View Post
    gone rid of the old shitty EZL Ignition
    LoooooL !!

    Hi Christian,

    At least in the US, the C36 had different power ratings depending on the year (1995-1997 model years here in the US).

    The last year of the car (1997) here it got a small HP bump up to 276 HP/284 lb-ft, from 268 HP/280 lb-ft. I believe it used HFM injection on that M104.

    I don't have much info in terms of reliability of the cars, but my own experience with M104s has been highly positive (head gaskets and wiring harnesses are common failure points, though after model year 1995 I don't know if this is a problem with the harnesses. Would be worth checking).

    Cheers,
    Gerry

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Hi,

    Having owned C36 and C43, I might have some personal insight to give you. For a winter car, I actually wouldn't suggest the C36. It's very reliable and gets the job done, but it has this go-kart feel compared to C43 - a thing I personally wouldn't look in a winter car. Engine is rev-happy and there isn't as much torque at the lower end of the powerband as you'd desire. In a word - C36 would be much more in place as a "dry and curvy road" vehicle.

    As for tuning, I never did anything to upgrade my AMG cars, because altering NA engines is so expensive if you're looking for serious gains that it's not worth it.

    Having said all that, I'd still take C36 over E420 any day. E420 is an ordinary big Benz, whereas C36 is a pure AMG (not too scientific, I know, but hey-it often comes down to how the car makes you feel).

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Quote Originally Posted by Christian_K View Post
    Compared to W124 E420: 279HP - 400NM Torque - ~1780kg weight - 0-62 6.8-7.0 seconds - V-max 250kph.
    Fuel economy is roughly around 20mpg, some people claim up to 25mpg on long slow highway trips.
    I can vouch for the 25mpg from the 124.034 on highway trips (at 80mph), but that's with the US-spec 2.24 gears. In Europe, the .034 got 2.65 gearing. The 124 and 202 are very different cars, it depends which you prefer. I haven't heard anything bad about the C36 though.

    For winter use on snow & ice, I seriously recommend a car with ASR; without ASR you'll be really wanting LSD. But I'd take ASR over LSD for street use on slippery roads.


    Dave M.
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    E500E Guru 2phast's Avatar
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    I owned a 95 C36 and it was a great car, but underpowered. The C43 on the other hand is miles above the C36 in performance. On the C43 front, the bad ass mod is to drop a 5.4l motor from the E55 in it. We did this recently with my friends C43, its wicked fast. The C43 with motor swap in on my bucket list.
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Thanks for the input gentlemen.
    Didn't all C36 had ASR/ESP ?

    I owned a 95 C36 and it was a great car, but underpowered. The C43 on the other hand is miles above the C36 in performance
    I don't want to afford a C43 as a winter car, thats a waste since the C43s cost almost as much as a 500E here (starting at 8000€ roughly), while the C36s are around 3500-5000€.
    Christian K.
    06/1992 500E - DB199 Blauschwarz-Metallic
    09/1989 300E - DB172 Anthrazitgrau-Metallic
    11/1998 E430 - DB339 Violan-Metallic
    06/2003 CL55 AMG KOMPRESSOR - DB197 Obsidianschwarz-Metallic


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    Intl 500E GTG coordinator 195910's Avatar
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Hi Christian,

    How about an W210 E420 for winter? M119 with ME and 5-speed auto.
    You get the M119 power without the problems of LH. Plus all the spare parts are very cheap and easy to find compared to C36 AMG which you will have to special order all the parts for.

    Here is a nice one (no links): http://suchen.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/sh...e&pageNumber=1

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Seems like too nice of a car to use specifically for the winter, don't you think...? Wouldn't you rather use something more "disposable" ? There are plenty of cheaper and better winter cars out there. I wouldn't want to take a nice C36 AMG out into the road salt / chemicals and sand. In fact, I have a cheap '99 Toyota 4Runner 4WD specifically for the winter. Plenty of 'em out there, I don't feel bad that it gets exposed to rough weather conditions, and I won't feel bad if it goes sliding off the road into a ditch or is hit by someone else on their way into a ditch.

    You're in Germany, buy an Opel
    Last edited by Silver Arrow; 08-16-2011 at 09:35 PM.
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    "I have a cheap '99 Toyota 4Runner 4WD specifically for the winter."

    Me too! It's the perfect winter support vehicle for my 500E.

    Others I know have a cheap 4wd SUV for anything they don't want to subject their MB to, with no regrets.
    1992 500E

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    All this talk about "winter vehicles" and "summer vehicles". Meh. Seems needlessly complicated.

    Why not just live in a climate where you can enjoy the SAME vehicle(s) all year around?
    I know, I know .. Houston .... Texas... heat...humidity ... blah blah blah. That's what air conditioning is for !!
    When I lived in the Northwest, A/C was just this lump of tubing and metal that got lugged around and reduced my MPG.
    Since I moved to the country of Texas it feels so GOOD to actually use the Benz's systems for what they were intended for, for 6-7 months out of the year

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Quote Originally Posted by T-500 View Post
    "I have a cheap '99 Toyota 4Runner 4WD specifically for the winter."

    Me too! It's the perfect winter support vehicle for my 500E.

    Others I know have a cheap 4wd SUV for anything they don't want to subject their MB to, with no regrets.
    Yes indeed - it's a great winter vehicle!

    Wouldn't want to see my 500E looking like this, that's for sure!!




    Quote Originally Posted by gerryvz View Post
    Why not just live in a climate where you can enjoy the SAME vehicle(s) all year around?
    I know, I know .. Houston .... Texas... heat...humidity ... blah blah blah. That's what air conditioning is for !!
    When I lived in the Northwest, A/C was just this lump of tubing and metal that got lugged around and reduced my MPG.
    Since I moved to the country of Texas it feels so GOOD to actually use the Benz's systems for what they were intended for, for 6-7 months out of the year
    Haha - showoff!!
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Looking at that frozen driveway and white stuff on the plants gives me the willies.
    But we "bundle up" in the winter putting on a long sleeve shirt and jeans.
    I hang my summer shorts on the hook on my closet door for about 6 weeks during Jan 1 - Feb 15, then start wearing them again.
    No need to even put them away in the dresser drawer. My sweaters got donated to Goodwill long ago.

  13. #13
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Quote Originally Posted by gerryvz View Post
    Since I moved to the country of Texas it feels so GOOD to actually use the Benz's systems for what they were intended for, for 6-7 months out of the year
    What! 6-7 months, is Texas that Hot? we use A/C for at least 8 months. I start using it in the evenings starting from late April (hate the power reduction).

    No Snow here, just sand !

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Generally here in Houston we use A/C (in the house) from about the end of March through mid to late October. But we're close to the water. Other areas that are more inland (Dallas, Austin, San Antonio) get quite a bit hotter and may even use their A/C longer. But yeah it's hot -- 95-100F daytime temperatures every single day from May through September. It gets down to 76-80F at night.

    I've attached our 10-day forecast for my town - I live about 25 miles north of downtown Houston.

    Cheers,
    Gerry
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Hmm. Thats as hot as some Gulf states now. We're slightly higher at 45-46C now.

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Bought the car 2 weeks after opening this topic. Little Silver baby with almost full options.
    Great car, great engine, i find it is a little beast as well. No signs of being underpowered, not really. With new stock tires and an empty fuel-tank, but with a second person on co-drivers seat, i can do 0-62mph in 6.3-6.4 seconds. And according to GPS the speedo is extremely accurate (100km/h speedo -> 100km/h verified via GPS)
    It always starts in first gear which now will be a MUST-HAVE for my 500E, so i will buy a FGS-Module for sure.
    Up to 160-180km/h i find it *almost* as quick as the 500E, although feeling and a clear comparison are two different pair of shoes. The 500E does clearly increase speed above 160km/h more effortless than the C36AMG, but hey, it as 1.4L more Displacement and ~115NM more Torque - no wonder.

    Fuel consumption was a "wonder" in End-Summer times (10L Super-PLUS per 100km in normal driving -> 23.6MPG), hell my old 190E 2.6L couldn't do it any better. However in our cold Winter it was 3.5L more per 100km (35% increase! -> 17.4MPG)
    However had a lot of Problems after buying it. Fuel-Pump broken, Wiring-Harness replaced, replaced nearly all Sensors (including IAT, O2, CPS, Camshaft-pos-sensor, etc.) after buying myself a Star-Diagnosis System, and found out that most of them were reading wrong values. Then the ECU went broken so i've had it repaired aswell (all 3 ignition amplifiers broken!). But after all that repairs, it never let me down this winter in which we had -20°C (-4°F) every Moring. Fired-up on the first key-turn and ran just fine up till today.
    Christian K.
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    09/1989 300E - DB172 Anthrazitgrau-Metallic
    11/1998 E430 - DB339 Violan-Metallic
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Great topic. I have a friend that chose a C280 sport without really looking into the C36 or C43. Now he knows that the C43 is available easily in the US...we're pushing him towards one . He's more keen on a C43 than C36 for some reason, so I like to read about experiences with both.

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    If I ever went that route, it would be a C55... common transplant for the C43 (dropping in an E55 motor). Big engine + little car = pocket rocket.


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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Quote Originally Posted by gsxr View Post
    If I ever went that route, it would be a C55... common transplant for the C43 (dropping in an E55 motor). Big engine + little car = pocket rocket.

    Haha, your late to the party with that comment
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Wooops! Sure am... LOL! Nice catch, Rik.


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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    36 over 43 all day long. 97 36 is a Really nice combo..722.6 and M104 AMG...Yum.
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    For me there were "economic reasons" for not buying a C43AMG. First of all the C-class should be my "daily driver", so it would be a "waste" to use the V8 C-Class for that, considering how rare it is. Second are the insane prices for spare-parts on the C43 Series compared to C36AMG, which is (besides the Engine and Gearbox) still a "normal" C280 Sport. Examples are brake-parts alone. C43 Brake Discs/Rotors for front are like 1000€ per piece (or was it 1000€ for both?). The list goes on and on.
    And last but not least, C36AMGs are compared to the C43AMGs much much cheaper. I wouldn't want to invest another "500E" like price for a C43AMG. So thats about it from my side, as to why i decided in favor of the C36AMG.
    And this is still a fast bitch, no shit. It is faster than the 190E Brabus 3.6 a friend of mine once owned.

    Yesterday i was driving away from a friend of mine with his "fancy" Audi A4 2.8L, and while giving kick-down from standing still, i was quickly turning my head back to see how i was getting distance to him and forth again and already had 100kph on the speedometer. This accelerations feels like its just a short "moment". I know that my 500E is around 0.5 seconds faster to 100kph, but it feels quicker in the lighter, little c-class somehow.
    Christian K.
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Quote Originally Posted by Christian_K View Post
    This accelerations feels like its just a short "moment". I know that my 500E is around 0.5 seconds faster to 100kph, but it feels quicker in the lighter, little c-class somehow.
    Ich beobachte nun, dass die Deutschen haben auch gute Arsch-Prüfstand ...... Genau wie wir Amerikaner !

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Quote Originally Posted by gerryvz View Post
    Ich beobachte nun, dass die Deutschen haben auch gute Arsch-Prüfstand ...... Genau wie wir Amerikaner !
    You can bet your Arsch on that hahahaha

    A few Pics of my C36AMG just days after bought it.














    Short Kickdown-Video (yes the cats have been removed by the pre-owner - i hate that raspy sound, will buy 100cell metal cats soon):
    Christian K.
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    09/1989 300E - DB172 Anthrazitgrau-Metallic
    11/1998 E430 - DB339 Violan-Metallic
    06/2003 CL55 AMG KOMPRESSOR - DB197 Obsidianschwarz-Metallic


  25. #25
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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    The owner of the neon blue 500E in Kuwait has just bought a C36 aswell. I will get them all to come to our new AMG&TUNER GTG 24/3 !

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    Re: W202 C36 AMG....

    Quote Originally Posted by Christian_K View Post
    Examples are brake-parts alone. C43 Brake Discs/Rotors for front are like 1000€ per piece (or was it 1000€ for both?). The list goes on and on.
    And last but not least, C36AMGs are compared to the C43AMGs much much cheaper.
    True, the multi-piece rotors on the C43 are insane! BUT, the simple solution is to just replace the entire front brake setup with C32 calipers/rotors. Better braking and when the time comes to replace the rotors, the C32 rotors are very inexpensive. Only downside to this is the front wheel fitament. The stock 17x7.5" wheels clear the C32 calipers but the 18x8" Monoblock does not. Soooo, a bit of "fine tuning" with a Dremel would be necessary (assuming you were using 18" wheels).
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