PDA

View Full Version : 1992 500e models more desirable than the later models?



Stevester 500E
04-15-2014, 06:53 PM
What makes the 92 500e models more desirable than the later models? The fact that they are equipped standard with LH WOT module or that the engine block is of close deck design? Way back when I was shopping, someone advised me to get a 92'

Is the closed deck only desirable if one is hoping to bore it out in the future?

gsxr
04-15-2014, 07:25 PM
What makes the 92 500e models more desirable than the later models? The fact that they are equipped standard with LH WOT module or that the engine block is of close deck design? Way back when I was shopping, someone advised me to get a 92'
I'm not sure why some people think 1992 is better. The closed-deck blocks were used through all of 1993 production and into early 1994 (USA) model years as well. Might just be the higher published power rating on the 1992 models.



Is the closed deck only desirable if one is hoping to bore it out in the future?
Yes, that is the only real advantage, IMO. And I've yet to see anyone actually bore out their closed-deck engine.

:stickpoke:

Glen
04-15-2014, 07:28 PM
Up until recently, many considered the '92s more desirable because they have more power and a closed deck block. And of course, some prefer the pre-facelift look.

But we now know that using an early LH with WOT enrichment in a late car actually makes more power than a '92. Plus, there is factory documentation that shows closed deck blocks were used into the '94 model year. So...IMHO, there really isn't any reason that any model year is more desirable, it all comes down to which one you like best.

Maui
04-15-2014, 07:38 PM
Up until recently, many considered the '92s more desirable because they have more power and a closed deck block. And of course, some prefer the pre-facelift look.

But we now know that using an early LH with WOT enrichment in a late car actually makes more power than a '92. Plus, there is factory documentation that shows closed deck blocks were used into the '94 model year. So...IMHO, there really isn't any reason that any model year is more desirable, it all comes down to which one you like best.

I like the look of the pre face lift front end better. It looks more vintage to me. The face lift reminds me of an S model, but seriously I like them all.

bryanjchen
04-15-2014, 07:59 PM
What I was told is that the later models were not built by Porsche, unlike the pre-94 models. Not sure if this is true or not, but have heard this several times from different people. Shouldn't the VIN show the factory designation where the car was built? Does anyone have the answer to this? I have a 94MY car.

sheward
04-15-2014, 08:37 PM
This is just a myth. All models were assembled by Porsche. There are many examples of proof of this including pictures here on the board. I like both "variations". The early grill does have a certain vintage look. The later models have a slightly more pleasing trunk shape and better radios. Early models have the nicer cream-beige interior color available.

drew

gsxr
04-15-2014, 09:00 PM
Drew is correct. They were all built by Porsche, through the end of production in 1994 (or 1995?). Not sure where that false information came from originally...

:detective:

bryanjchen
04-16-2014, 12:05 AM
Cool, though I know there is a similar story with the 16v, I think this one may be true, which is that the headers/engine in later models were not done by Cosworth but rather brought back in house by MB.

richardhilton590
10-07-2014, 07:32 PM
I don't agree that 1992 is better than the later models. In my opinion, the later models have improved gradually which fare better that a 1992. But I guess it all boils down to personal preferences.

maw1124
10-07-2014, 07:52 PM
I like the look of the pre face lift front end better. It looks more vintage to me. The face lift reminds me of an S model, but seriously I like them all.

My choice was about the vintage look (already had an S Class) and the WOT enrichment. But I don't know about more desirable. If anything, I see a preference for the "facelifted" or "last model year" cars. If it's future value you're concerned about, I think folks will tell you the facelifted '94s are appreciating more rapidly.

Knowing all that, I'm glad I got a '92.

;-D

maw

Maui
10-08-2014, 11:07 AM
I personally like the 500E preface lift. It has more of a classic car look and a little more aggressive to my eye. As for power I think a 93 or 94 with WOT is the way to go. 1993 is the best year as far as I am concerned.

Glen
10-08-2014, 11:31 AM
The absolute best year is the one (or more) that you own. Having said that, I have a preference for post-facelift cars.
The one thing that can't be debated is that Brilliant Silver is the fastest color!:roadrunner:

:)

KarlC
10-08-2014, 11:39 AM
I personally like the 500E preface lift. It has more of a classic car look and a little more aggressive to my eye. As for power I think a 93 or 94 with WOT is the way to go. 1993 is the best year as far as I am concerned.

Maui, as usual you are 100% right, 93 is the best year and I have found it to be factual that 040 is the faster color by far. You will know this to be true as you have an 040 car and Glen will soon be changing his mind and painting his 199 car to 040 for the same reason.

gerryvz
10-08-2014, 11:55 AM
The fastest E500E is always the one equipped with NOS, supercharger or a 6.0+ displacement. DB199 is always worth minus 0.2 seconds in the quarter-mile.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Melville
10-08-2014, 12:05 PM
Maui, as usual you are 100% right, 93 is the best year and I have found it to be factual that 040 is the faster color by far. You will know this to be true as you have an 040 car and Glen will soon be changing his mind and painting his 199 car to 040 for the same reason.

But you forget that the speed benefit conveyed by a particular car is counteracted by a fresh wash and wax of car with a less powerful color. Everyone knows that a freshly washed car is faster, runs better, etc. Now if you steam clean the carpets that's a whole different ball game.

gerryvz
10-08-2014, 12:07 PM
Now if you steam clean the carpets that's a whole different ball game.
A fresh set of muffler bearings can work wonders for a car's performance.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

texas993
10-08-2014, 12:14 PM
A fresh set of muffler bearings can work wonders for a car's performance.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

GVZ, can you please give me a part number for those bearings? And a detailed DIY?

I will do that after my blinker fluid flush. I am trying to source MB branded and properly aged fluid. Really hard to find. May have to get Vader's help.

clarkz71
10-08-2014, 12:34 PM
You don't want them from Gerry. He's using OE Benz bearings.

I have and can get you trick F1 ceramic muffler bearings, way more suited for high heat.

clarkz71
10-08-2014, 12:40 PM
Maui, as usual you are 100% right, 93 is the best year and I have found it to be factual that 040 is the faster color by far. You will know this to be true as you have an 040 car and Glen will soon be changing his mind and painting his 199 car to 040 for the same reason.


1993 is also the best year the 034, unlike the 036 the 93 400E
was the 1st year for 275hp. The 92 LH module adds 15 for 290hp

1992 was 268hp, do the math. 22hp is nothing to sneeze at.

By the way, both 034/036 use the same muffler bearings

J-Sauce
10-08-2014, 01:29 PM
Everyone knows that a freshly washed car is faster

FALSE! Despite the added weight of the cumulative dirt molecules, a dirty car will still be faster! This is due to an effect similar to the forces acting on a golf ball. The dimples in a golf ball effectively surround it in a pillow of air that reduces its drag and allows it to travel further. Air clings to the smooth surface of a freshly waxed car, while the dirt creates a small layer of turbulence that emulates that pillow of air on a golf ball. :)

Maui
10-08-2014, 01:37 PM
1993 is also the best year the 034, unlike the 036 the 93 400E
was the 1st year for 275hp. The 92 LH module adds 15 for 290hp

1992 was 268hp, do the math. 22hp is nothing to sneeze at.

By the way, both 034/036 use the same muffler bearings

The muffler bearings are NLA you'll need to contact URO parts directly but they do come in many colors and finishes.

KarlC
10-08-2014, 01:39 PM
FALSE! Despite the added weight of the cumulative dirt molecules, a dirty car will still be faster! This is due to an effect similar to the forces acting on a golf ball. The dimples in a golf ball effectively surround it in a pillow of air that reduces its drag and allows it to travel further. Air clings to the smooth surface of a freshly waxed car, while the dirt creates a small layer of turbulence that emulates that pillow of air on a golf ball. :)

LOL that's classic !!!

Maui
10-08-2014, 01:40 PM
GVZ, can you please give me a part number for those bearings? And a detailed DIY?

I will do that after my blinker fluid flush. I am trying to source MB branded and properly aged fluid. Really hard to find. May have to get Vader's help.

Make sure you sue the green fluid or else your blinkers will become brake lights.

Maui
10-08-2014, 01:44 PM
FALSE! Despite the added weight of the cumulative dirt molecules, a dirty car will still be faster! This is due to an effect similar to the forces acting on a golf ball. The dimples in a golf ball effectively surround it in a pillow of air that reduces its drag and allows it to travel further. Air clings to the smooth surface of a freshly waxed car, while the dirt creates a small layer of turbulence that emulates that pillow of air on a golf ball. :)

I call foul. Everyone knows professional golfers clean their balls after every hole.

Maui
10-08-2014, 01:49 PM
Maui, as usual you are 100% right, 93 is the best year and I have found it to be factual that 040 is the faster color by far. You will know this to be true as you have an 040 car and Glen will soon be changing his mind and painting his 199 car to 040 for the same reason.

I've also noticed that I drive faster in the 040 car just so I can get it into the garage and covered up as quickly as possible.

J-Sauce
10-08-2014, 06:30 PM
I call foul. Everyone knows professional golfers clean their balls after every hole.I think you're thinking of another profession. :p But yes, golfers do clean their equipment, but the dimples are already in the ball!

http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/sports/golf/basics/question37.htm

Maui
10-08-2014, 07:59 PM
I'm a Titleist Pro V1 man myself. The best golf ball ever made.

A clean dimple is better than a dirty dimple.

gerryvz
10-08-2014, 08:23 PM
I am a 1994 owner, but over the years I've tried to look at the ownership thing objectively. I actually like the pre-facelift and facelift grill and trunk about equally - no clear preference for either, and I'd gladly own either/both with no prejudice. If I was forced at gunpoint to make a choice, it would be the facelift grill.

I think the facelift (generally 1994) models are best because they contained a host of design and mechanical improvements that accumulated during the production life of the cars. The only major negative I can think of for the 1994 (and 1993) cars was the removal of the WOT enrichment, but this is solved easily enough. I don't think the open-deck block is an issue at all; and the aluminum cam oiler tube deal is also solved easily enough (and has not generally (yet) been a major issue for the majority of owners).

There are other things for the later cars (through the 1993 and for the 1994 model year cars) that are pretty significant pluses for me, from a mechanical standpoint:


Waaaaay improved belt tensioner design
larger front and rear brakes over earlier cars
better & easier to mod/upgrade stock stereo system (US cars)
better looking bumper impact strip paint setup (IMHO)
better aux fan relay/fuse setup (IMHO)

My two cents.

Cheers,
Gerry

gerryvz
10-08-2014, 08:27 PM
GVZ, can you please give me a part number for those bearings? 003 589 00 45 is the part number.

Vader's bearings are BOSCH and made in Russia - they are not the BOSCH muffler bearings that are made in Germany for MB. Don't be fooled.

Stevester 500E
10-08-2014, 09:57 PM
:run::run::run::run:+1
Same theory applies to surfboards. Shiny glassy surfboards have more resistance than sand finished surfboards-similar theory of the golf ball.-
So, Sauce man, being you have a matte finish on your car by way of the vinyl wrap/plasti-dip, your car has less resistance.
But the added weight of the plasti-dip might cancel out the benefit of the aero-dynamic advantage your car has, not sure. But your car probably has another advantage, your custom made bumper lip !
FALSE! Despite the added weight of the cumulative dirt molecules, a dirty car will still be faster! This is due to an effect similar to the forces acting on a golf ball. The dimples in a golf ball effectively surround it in a pillow of air that reduces its drag and allows it to travel further. Air clings to the smooth surface of a freshly waxed car, while the dirt creates a small layer of turbulence that emulates that pillow of air on a golf ball. :)

Klink
10-08-2014, 10:47 PM
I call foul. Everyone knows professional golfers clean their balls after every hole.


I think you're thinking of another profession. :p But yes, golfers do clean their equipment, but the dimples are already in the ball!




I'm a Titleist Pro V1 man myself. The best golf ball ever made.

Works on balls too! Just sayin' As Vince Offer says, "It's made in Germany! You know the Germans make good stuff!" For that matter you could use one of Vince's Shamwows with this stuff! "I dunno, It sells itself!"

:wank307:

maw1124
10-08-2014, 11:16 PM
It's gotta be #20. It's just gotta.

maw

Jim
10-09-2014, 03:39 AM
The AC Tempmatic Controller is in the mix when making a choice I think.

Klink
10-09-2014, 04:18 AM
The AC Tempmatic Controller is in the mix when making a choice I think.

Well, maybe for you over there in Blighty. Here in the land of the free we got them with the single temp pushbutton automatic system only...

samiam44
10-09-2014, 06:55 AM
which ever year is in your driveway is the best=0) Mine is a 93'

Melville
10-09-2014, 07:30 AM
FALSE! Despite the added weight of the cumulative dirt molecules, a dirty car will still be faster! This is due to an effect similar to the forces acting on a golf ball. The dimples in a golf ball effectively surround it in a pillow of air that reduces its drag and allows it to travel further. Air clings to the smooth surface of a freshly waxed car, while the dirt creates a small layer of turbulence that emulates that pillow of air on a golf ball. :)



You've convinced me. I'm going to stop showering in an effort to shave off some of my commute time in my walk to work. I suspect this will surround me in a pillow of a certain type of air, but maybe not the type that reduces drag. But it will get other people to move out of my way.