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Thread: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

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    Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    hey people
    I have been noticing a "problem" with my cruisecontrol for quite some time..as a matter of fact from back when i got the car
    But i seem to notice is it..and then forget about it ..and shove it under the rug ,as i havent bothered trying to find out what is causing this issues.

    The issue at hand is:
    When driving at high way speeds...say..40/50mph"s and upwards to 70mph..when the cruise control is activated...the car does not hold its speed stable...it kinda "jerks" back and forth ..or..it feels like it is holding and then not holding the speed..but in a minor fashion.
    It is not like you are rocking back and forth big time in your seat..but you can definetly notice it feeling like you are switching it off and on..but like i said..in a very minor way.
    once you turn the cruisecontroll off..and keeping the speed stable with the accelerator pedal..it is smooth..

    Does anyone have a suggestion..or maybe you have had the same "issue" with your car?
    I have a feeling it might be something with the ETA,,but i really dont know..as i havent dug into it with the diagnostic appppparaaatus.

    When using the cruisecontrol at "normal" speeds...say 25-35/40...it seems like it is doing fine..maybe it is just less noticable in slow speeds...for some reason..i dont know..and it baffles me..

    Any suggestions much apreaciated
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    I have EXACTLY the same symptoms when using CC on highway - just like it would go on/off in a very gentle way. I just cannot confirm it is fine at lower speeds - I only use it on highway (140 - 160 kmh). It drove me crazy at the beginning but now I used to it however I'd love to have it sorted out...
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by darek_u View Post
    I have EXACTLY the same symptoms when using CC on highway - just like it would go on/off in a very gentle way. I just cannot confirm it is fine at lower speeds - I only use it on highway (140 - 160 kmh). It drove me crazy at the beginning but now I used to it however I'd love to have it sorted out...
    I'd wager eta.

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    I was told by PO that ETA was cleaned, whatever it means. I guess just inside of the pipe where throttle plate is. I don't think that it has ever been opened and wires replaced etc.
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by darek_u View Post
    I was told by PO that ETA was cleaned, whatever it means. I guess just inside of the pipe where throttle plate is. I don't think that it has ever been opened and wires replaced etc.
    That means nothing...

    so much more then wires fail now.



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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    That means nothing...
    That's what I thought... Other than the slight surging when using CC car behaves normal, at least in my opinion. There are no codes stored in the memory as well.
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Check your intake temp sensor.

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    Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    In the cc unit there are capicitors that needs replacement over time.
    Bad capicitors could cause the fluctuating speeds.
    Last edited by Hakie; 1 Week Ago at 07:04 AM.

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Lowman do you have spare modules or an ETA to try in your 500E? I'm not sure if a flat such as this will log on DAS but might also be worth a look.
    1987 w124 200 - 3.6 AMG build | 1990 w124 300E-24 | 1992 w124 500E

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Lots of good suggestions here..many of them i dont want to "agnowledge",or hoping not to be the culprit.
    The ETA on my car has e new"er date on it..cant remember if it was 2004 or 2007..so im "hoping" and believing it is not the ETA..as i do not have any other faults what so ever on the car that would indicate a faulty ETA wiring...what it can be though is a "switch" inside the ETA that is playing up.
    The LH unit does not play up in any other way...would bad capasitors not give other symptoms aswell?

    JC220 ..no i do not have any spare modules to try out..and like mentioned .i have not driven the car with the diagnostics connected either..to have a look at the actual values..so for now it is all "guess" work..and seeing if others have had the same "issue"..and it seems so..but no specific solution for now it seems.
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve119 View Post
    Check your intake temp sensor.
    Why?or..hehe..it is there ..and it is working...why would this have anything to do with the CC ?
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Hakie View Post
    In the cc unit there are capicitors that needs replacement over time.
    Bad capicitors could cause the fluctuating speeds.
    Oh CC unit..not the LH unit..i misread that..did you mean the E Gas module?
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    I will do some testing while waiting for some more suggestions ,,and hopefully get back with some results
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by lowman View Post
    Oh CC unit..not the LH unit..i misread that..did you mean the E Gas module?
    The cc has a "SG" (steuer gerate). The condensators of this unit needs replacement. It's a separate unit.

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    Last edited by JC220; 1 Week Ago at 09:18 AM.
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by lowman View Post
    no i do not have any spare modules to try out..
    PS- I like having a spare set of known good – tested E500E spares on hand for troubleshooting (And of course if a part does fail in the future) Full set of modules, MAF, EZL, both ignition coils and an updated ETA. It’s a great idea to have at least one set such as this.
    20180916_162415.jpg

    These are the exact matching PN's for my 1992 Euro 500E which took a while to find.
    1987 w124 200 - 3.6 AMG build | 1990 w124 300E-24 | 1992 w124 500E

    1994 320CE Sportline | 1997 w140 S280 | 2007 w211 E220CDI

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Hakie View Post
    The cc has a "SG" (steuer gerate). The condensators of this unit needs replacement. It's a separate unit.
    yeah..which is the Egas module?
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by JC220 View Post
    PS- I like having a spare set of known good – tested E500E spares on hand for troubleshooting (And of course if a part does fail in the future) Full set of modules, MAF, EZL, both ignition coils and an updated ETA. It’s a great idea to have at least one set such as this.
    20180916_162415.jpg

    These are the exact matching PN's for my 1992 Euro 500E which took a while to find.
    You bad bad bad bad hoarder
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by JC220 View Post
    I recall similar complaints from member Matin about his car being unstable at speed and accelerating itself. I did some searching and initially found these 2x threads. Where he first tired an E Gas but ultimately found that the updated (2012?) ETA was actually the culprit. So he fitted another 2006 made ETA and all was good.

    https://www.500eboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10482



    https://www.500eboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11306



    https://www.500eboard.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10180


    oh yeah..i remember those threads.Hm..ill look into them once more.Thanx
    But it is not completely the same "symptom"..as my car does not have any issues other than the allready mentioned "fault" to the Cruise control...it does not speed up...or does not have any symptoms indicationg an ETA failure..my ETA is not that new either..it is either 07 or 04..
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by lowman View Post
    You bad bad bad bad hoarder
    Yes I have some serious parts hoarding issues – but I have been encouraged by 500E board content so you guys are partly to blame!

    480x318.jpg
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    1994 320CE Sportline | 1997 w140 S280 | 2007 w211 E220CDI

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by lowman View Post
    Oh CC unit..not the LH unit..i misread that..did you mean the E Gas module?

    On my W123 it is a common problem whereby the circuit board inside the cruise control unit needed to have its solder reflowed. All it takes is one slightly loose (cracked) contact for the speed to vary, surge or hiccup ever so slightly.

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by JC220 View Post
    Yes I have some serious parts hoarding issues – but I have been encouraged by 500E board content so you guys are partly to blame!

    480x318.jpg
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Who said egas module failuers are rare??? That's the Most common module failure point that we have seen here in the shop by a Long run! I have over 10 500e egas modules with one issue or another.

    Again, given the age of his eta I'd lean heavily towards that... Late date code eta's used to be reliable....not so much anymore.

    None or my egas failures have caused wonkey cruise control fwtw..

    Jono

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by JC220 View Post
    PS- I like having a spare set of known good – tested E500E spares on hand for troubleshooting (And of course if a part does fail in the future) Full set of modules, MAF, EZL, both ignition coils and an updated ETA. It’s a great idea to have at least one set such as this.
    20180916_162415.jpg

    These are the exact matching PN's for my 1992 Euro 500E which took a while to find.
    I have that same picture!!
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by jhodg5ck View Post
    Who said egas module failuers are rare??? That's the Most common module failure point that we have seen here in the shop by a Long run! I have over 10 500e egas modules with one issue or another.

    Again, given the age of his eta I'd lean heavily towards that... Late date code eta's used to be reliable....not so much anymore.

    None or my egas failures have caused wonkey cruise control fwtw..

    Jono

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    See posts #10 + #11 here

    Which is where it was said that E Gas failures are rare. Also - they agree that the E Gas failure would tend to trip a fault code and not impact on cruise control operation
    1987 w124 200 - 3.6 AMG build | 1990 w124 300E-24 | 1992 w124 500E

    1994 320CE Sportline | 1997 w140 S280 | 2007 w211 E220CDI

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by nocfn View Post
    I have that same picture!!
    You mean the same spares?.. I took this pic in my living room an hour ago! (A great place to have your E500E spares available to hand)
    1987 w124 200 - 3.6 AMG build | 1990 w124 300E-24 | 1992 w124 500E

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    I too have a complete replacement kit like that: CAN, ezl, eta, maf. Some other bits but the posted suspects are sitting on 3rd floor climate control storage...
    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by JC220 View Post
    PS- I like having a spare set of known good – tested E500E spares on hand for troubleshooting (And of course if a part does fail in the future) Full set of modules, MAF, EZL, both ignition coils and an updated ETA. It’s a great idea to have at least one set such as this.
    20180916_162415.jpg

    These are the exact matching PN's for my 1992 Euro 500E which took a while to find.
    I have a spare LH ECU, a spare ETA, and a spare B. Module.

    I do not have a spare EZL (although I recently replaced the heat sink paste on mine), nor do I have a spare MAF, EGAS Module, or ABS Module.
    Which one might you suggest as next in priority to obtain? As well, when obtaining spare EZLs, should one obtain a Siemens unit or a Bosch unit?
    Thanks.
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Which one may be a GSXR item, i know I have all the spares and year of manufacture/brand he felt ideal.

    1994 E500
    249/275 - 8F19 or 8F32 or 8320

    1991 560 SEC
    199/268
    2014 E350 Cab 799/264

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    Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by lowman View Post
    yeah..which is the Egas module?
    It is the control unit under the cover at the steering column.
    IMG_5545.JPG
    Last edited by Hakie; 1 Week Ago at 11:35 AM.

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Jlaa View Post
    I have a spare LH ECU, a spare ETA, and a spare B. Module.

    I do not have a spare EZL (although I recently replaced the heat sink paste on mine), nor do I have a spare MAF, EGAS Module, or ABS Module.
    Which one might you suggest as next in priority to obtain? As well, when obtaining spare EZLs, should one obtain a Siemens unit or a Bosch unit?
    Thanks.
    I would think a spare MAF next, EZL then the other modules if there had to be a pecking order to it. IMO at least! I have read before that the Siemens units are more reliable than Bosch – but for a Spare unit if you can snag a Bosch at a decent price I’d go for it.
    1987 w124 200 - 3.6 AMG build | 1990 w124 300E-24 | 1992 w124 500E

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    This is good to know.

    Perhaps this is a good way to see if an ETA is 100 percent functional-put the car on CC and see how it behaves.

    I know the best way is to bench test all components, but putting it in CC and observing behavior is quick.

    Quote Originally Posted by jhodg5ck View Post
    I'd wager eta.

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Stevester 500E View Post
    This is good to know.

    Perhaps this is a good way to see if an ETA is 100 percent functional-put the car on CC and see how it behaves.

    I know the best way is to bench test all components, but putting it in CC and observing behavior is quick.
    Always. Bench testing is good, but nothing compares to install and drive

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Hakie View Post
    It is the control unit under the cover at the steering column.
    IMG_5545.JPG
    The E Gas module in V8 W124's lives in the coffin box within the engine compartment. See image below. The Coffin box is in the rear right of the engine compartment.

    IMG_0608.JPG

    The image you posted in post #30 above appears to be a cruise control Amp. (I am not 100% sure if the E500E had such an amp but other 6 cyl etc models did)
    1987 w124 200 - 3.6 AMG build | 1990 w124 300E-24 | 1992 w124 500E

    1994 320CE Sportline | 1997 w140 S280 | 2007 w211 E220CDI

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  57. #35
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Check your intake temp sensor.
    I have brand new sensor (less than 1000 km) but, like others said, I highly doubt it would cause any problems with CC.

    In the cc unit there are capicitors that needs replacement over time.
    Bad capicitors could cause the fluctuating speeds.
    There are very few electrolytic capacitors in EGAS module - see picture. It would become pretty obvious that they are bad for anybody who opens the module box. On the other hand I've been already in this boat with my Porsche - I had to replace the capacitors because the CC module was basically dead. I did a lot of research that time and the conclusion was that bad capacitors give all sort of SEVERE symptoms, like dead module, self accelerating, sudden surges, switching off CC during driving etc. It doesn't mean that they cannot be the culprit here but I doubt it.
    Just my 2 cents...

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  59. #36
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Hakie View Post
    It is the control unit under the cover at the steering column.
    IMG_5545.JPG
    The m119 does not have a separate CC unit..it is controlled by the EGAS module.The one in the picture is "lesser" engine version..say a 300e and such..they have a separate CC unit
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
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  61. #37
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    lots of babble here allready I Like it
    Ive dones some "minor" adjustment and test work today.Though in some way it shouldnt have anything to do with the CC fluctuating
    I had a look at my throttle linkage today..and i found it to be slightly off.so i took of the connecting rod..cleaned the ends..lubricated the ballsockets
    Adjusted the throttle linkage to be spot on.But i guess this has more to do with "pickup"...when accelerating and stuff..gearshift and such.
    Anyways..good thing to have it adjusted properly..as i do feel it was abit off..as you can see on the pictures.The WIS states that the two "notches" has to be perfectly aligned..and mine was not before i adjusted it.
    Here are some pictures to complete my explanataion

    Here you can see the two notches are slightly off


    Cleaned out the socket


    Cleaned the ballend


    Lubricated the ballsocket


    Adjusted the connecting rod,so the two notches aligns
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by lowman View Post
    lots of babble here allready I Like it
    Ive dones some "minor" adjustment and test work today.Though in some way it shouldnt have anything to do with the CC fluctuating
    I had a look at my throttle linkage today..and i found it to be slightly off.so i took of the connecting rod..cleaned the ends..lubricated the ballsockets
    Adjusted the throttle linkage to be spot on.But i guess this has more to do with "pickup"...when accelerating and stuff..gearshift and such.
    Anyways..good thing to have it adjusted properly..as i do feel it was abit off..as you can see on the pictures.The WIS states that the two "notches" has to be perfectly aligned..and mine was not before i adjusted it.
    Here are some pictures to complete my explanataion
    The notches aligned are a good starting point for accelerator pedal/transmission characteristics. Shouldn't really play into cruise control..but I have seen stranger things.

    99.9% of throttle linkages that come in are dirty/dry...so yes, always a good idea to clean a lubricate! Q tips are great for cleaning. We use Worth Anti Seize as a lubricant..copper based and it thinks nothing of the heat the engine bay throws at it


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  64. #39
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by lowman View Post
    The m119 does not have a separate CC unit..it is controlled by the EGAS module.The one in the picture is "lesser" engine version..say a 300e and such..they have a separate CC unit
    Sorry, did not know that. . Still, should check the capacitors. Cheap components so worth a try.

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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Hakie View Post
    Sorry, did not know that. . Still, should check the capacitors. Cheap components so worth a try.
    no no no..no need to say sorry mate
    ..i was just confused at what you were talking about..and at some point..i could "correct" you and tell you that there is no such thing as CC unit on the 500e"s...that was similar to the one you talked about.So its all good
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Reporting back
    As expected really...the adjustment of the throttle linkage did not have any effect on the cruise control "jerking" when activated issue.
    I have also taken apart my Egas module..so i will be posting some pictures of this later.
    I do not feel that i want to take it appart completely..as i do not want to screw it up..but i will post pictures..for all to see.
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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  70. #42
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    here is the pictures of my Egas unit insides And partsnumber.Which is the correct ..and the only one FOR the "pre"facelift..at least that is what the chassisnumbers are indicating.
    Anyways..If someone have tried a different Egas unit.from say a w140..or r129..let me know please.
    When it comes to do further work to this one..i will have to separate the main printboard from the bottom housing..which does not seem like a thing to just "try out..unless you are 100% certain of how its done..withouth breaking anything.So..have someone taken a similar one like this appart?the row of black "springs(6 in total..situated on the right hand side of the module)...holding it down seems to be the worst obstacle to tackle...alongside it beeing partly "glued" down there...
    As longs as i cant separate it..i cant check the capasitors..OR other soldering points to see if they have cracked soldering..so for now ...i havent done more than visual checks of the top side here.

    I think i can spot some old moisture residue on the print board standing 90 degrees up... i would like to have your views also?if you have experienced the same type of moisture residue...AND having the same "issue"...as i am having with my "Cruise control".

    Any points of view is massivly wanted...

    Here is the pics..in no particular order.



    The capasitors does not look like they have puffed out...blown up...but as long as i cant separate the print board from the housing..i cant measure them either..




    On this picture you can spot the old moisture residue ...on the printboard standing vertical.


    Partsnumber
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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  72. #43
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Had a couple of these back in the day...
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Putting the fun in dysfunction...

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  74. #44
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Klink View Post
    Had a couple of these back in the day...
    Wow, talk about a root-cause that nooooooooooo one would ever think of ---- an out of spec wheel hub!!!
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  75. #45
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Jlaa View Post
    Wow, talk about a root-cause that nooooooooooo one would ever think of ---- an out of spec wheel hub!!!
    How BIZARRE! And only the left side? (The right side uses the identical part number.)


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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    I had some issue with a mix of dirt and corrosion on the front right side wheel hub on my 2.5-16 when I first bought it. Checked and re adjusted the wheel bearing play first, then cleaned and then replaced the wheel speed sensor without any improvement. Thorough cleaning of the sensor ring with a wire brush in the drill machine and some thin layer of paint after solved the issue. Problem indicated only on higher speeds, about 120+ km/h, then the ABS / ASD light came on.
    Sine our 589 lowmann has already overhauled his front axle, I didn't throw that one in earlier...
    Maybe try to swap the hub with another one and if it's still the same look into the capacitors. I had replaced capacitors on (engine) speedometers and clocks of the ICM of various older MBs some have been blown - this very often related to a burnt resistor on the board too, some did not and looked fine also no harm on the resistors yet.
    W123, W124, R129, W163, W201, R230

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  78. #47
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Oh, the other hub can also have a tolerance issue too, but apparently it creates no problem. I am pretty sure that the speed signal for cruise control operation is taken exclusively from, or is at least heavily biased by the left front wheel speed sensor signal. This would make sense, as 129 vehicles from this era DO operate that way, and use the same hubs. Yet interestingly, I know of no such surging issue with 129 vehicles using the same parts.

    “Unfavorable stacking of tolerance” issues like this can be particularly dumbfounding. For example, the 129 having no issue from this can be related to the different gearing, different throttle response rates under cruise control, who knows. This is exactly the kind of crap you deal with at the dealer level, particularly when new product is introduced, parts vendors are changed, etc. etc. It’s always an adventure.

    I have to get back at it, but somebody, remind me to tell you about a recent adventure on 164 vehicles that involves aftermarket wheel speed sensors. Good times!

    Putting the fun in dysfunction...

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  80. #48
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Rouven036 View Post
    I had some issue with a mix of dirt and corrosion on the front right side wheel hub on my 2.5-16 when I first bought it. Checked and re adjusted the wheel bearing play first, then cleaned and then replaced the wheel speed sensor without any improvement. Thorough cleaning of the sensor ring with a wire brush in the drill machine and some thin layer of paint after solved the issue. Problem indicated only on higher speeds, about 120+ km/h, then the ABS / ASD light came on.
    Sine our 589 lowmann has already overhauled his front axle, I didn't throw that one in earlier...
    Maybe try to swap the hub with another one and if it's still the same look into the capacitors. I had replaced capacitors on (engine) speedometers and clocks of the ICM of various older MBs some have been blown - this very often related to a burnt resistor on the board too, some did not and looked fine also no harm on the resistors yet.
    thank you for suggestion.
    It is not "valid" for my case i think..as i do not have a abs/asr light come on.
    One thing i did not mention..was that i have had the same fault from when i got the car..until now..so it has nothing to do with the sensorring on the hub

    That said..it MAY be the hub itself...as i did not change around the hubs when i restored the front suspension.The hubs are the same as before the resto..
    So i will go after this suggestion you and klink came up with.
    There are no dust or rust on the sensor and ring...BUT i will measure out the clearance between the sensor and sensor ring..and report back
    Or even try out the 400e hubs i have laying around

    Thank you
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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  82. #49
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Klink View Post
    Oh, the other hub can also have a tolerance issue too, but apparently it creates no problem. I am pretty sure that the speed signal for cruise control operation is taken exclusively from, or is at least heavily biased by the left front wheel speed sensor signal. This would make sense, as 129 vehicles from this era DO operate that way, and use the same hubs. Yet interestingly, I know of no such surging issue with 129 vehicles using the same parts.

    “Unfavorable stacking of tolerance” issues like this can be particularly dumbfounding. For example, the 129 having no issue from this can be related to the different gearing, different throttle response rates under cruise control, who knows. This is exactly the kind of crap you deal with at the dealer level, particularly when new product is introduced, parts vendors are changed, etc. etc. It’s always an adventure.

    I have to get back at it, but somebody, remind me to tell you about a recent adventure on 164 vehicles that involves aftermarket wheel speed sensors. Good times!

    I definetly know about the 164 wheel speed sensorsthe 164 ones beeing active..and the aftermarked ones are not active sensors
    Also seen quite a few examples of corroced connection points through the wheel wells up front.

    Anywhooo...i would like to thank you for the wis document..that is a good find..i did not find it myself..as i have been looking through the manuals myself on "troubleshooting /preset faults with solution /possible culprit "section..

    So thank you...i will investigate this hub/clearance thing
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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  84. #50
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    i did some quick search on the EPC
    And my car does come up with the 0425 ending partsnumber for the hub
    And all 124036 has this partsnumber...
    But the early r129 300 had A1293300125, which then was superceeded by A1293300425

    MAYBE the early 124036 "could" have been fitted with the early hub (A1293300125)

    Just a thought...
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

  85. #51
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Here is my little update from todays doings.
    Ive checked the gap between the sensor and sensor ring.Both on right hand side and left hand side.
    Ive inspected the tip of the sensors.
    Ive also inspected the sensorring on the hub

    Checking the left hand side,as you can see on the pictures,i measured the height from the mounting face of the sensor..and down to the bottom of the grooves in the sensor ring.Its just a reference measurment..not an actual "gap" measurment





    Checking the right hand side





    Inspecting the wheel sensor on the left hand side..i did not get a picture of the right hand side..Looks very good.did a minor brushing to the sensor..but they are definetly not "bad" when it comes to rust.




    Inspecting the left hand side sensorring on the hub...abit hard to see on this picture..but it is decent.



    mounted back on





    So now..here comes the interesting part

    I did a comparison measure..between the two sensors.I measured the internal resistance..which is not always a good indicator for how good the sensor is..but often it is.
    I did not shoot any pictures....but the left hand side had 1.03 kOhms, the right hand side had 1.08 kOhms

    I did measure the sensors inducing voltage...the right hand side induced 0.5 volts at "my maximum spinning the wheel with my arm"
    The left hand side sensor induced 0.3volts,,at "my maximum spinning the wheel with my arm"

    So this CAN mean..that i have something going on with my Abs sensor"ing.Either something going on with my hub...OR sensor not reading accurate.
    The speed i got to run the wheel..is not accurate..but they showed signs of beeing "not the same"...so i think im on to something here.
    So i will investigate this further
    Last edited by lowman; 1 Day Ago at 04:48 AM.
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
    1989 w201 190e 2.5-16 Evo spec "Evoltwin"
    2003 Ford Focus Rs (Sold )

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  87. #52
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    I have read an article where bad/faulty ABS sensors can trigger limp mode also.


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  89. #53
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    Re: Not stable speed when Cruise control activitated at high way speeds?suggestions please

    Quote Originally Posted by Eno View Post
    I have read an article where bad/faulty ABS sensors can trigger limp mode also.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    that would be correct...but that would be relavant to if the car uses "one specific" sensor for a specific function...say..if the left front speed sensor is used as a speed sensor that Abs uses..and Cruice control..and even the LH unit...then it could cause the car to go into limp mode
    If in limp mode..it would throw a faultcode..and even a check "abs" check engine light.

    My car however is not in limp mode.
    But i do feel im onto something with the different readings from the two front sensors..
    I do not have different readings on my 190e..which i did make a video about measuring the front sensors...so i do have a stomach feeling that says something about " replace those Abs sensors.
    I have at this moment actually ordered a new left hand side sensor..Also considering ordering a right hand side..but i will try out the left hand side first..as this is the one that is most likely to be "faulty"...as it was more "hesitant" in reading correctly...it seemed to be the slowest reading of the two.and i did not get the full reading i would expect.
    1992 w124 500e "Blackbeauty"
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