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Thread: OWNER - JC220

  1. #901
    E500E Guru maw1124's Avatar
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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    Well, I'm not sure there's a difference there, Dave, so I want to probe it a bit more. Klink uses the term "frictionally" equivalent, which leads me to think that the larger swept area in the rear with the newer master cylinder means absolutely nothing in terms of stopping friction. I don't know why that would be.

    So Klink, how do you conclude they are "frictionally" equivalent, despite the larger swept area, setting aside the switching master cylinder? Or are you saying the smaller brakes with the "old" master cylinder provides the same stopping force as the "new" master cylinder with larger rear brakes?

    Am I to take it that the "new" master cylinder is similar to the "new" (post '92) .036 engine? Slightly "weaker" engine and slightly "weaker" master cylinder, almost admitting the prior cars were a bit overbuilt? Trying to get inside MB's (that is, "your") brain here...

    maw

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  3. #902
    E500E Guru JC220's Avatar
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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    I believe my 500E does have a switchable master cylinder from factory.

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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    I can clarify a bit on the "new" master cylinder. The FSM explains it better than I can... see section G of job 42-0700, linked below. Note there are 4 pages of information:

    http://www.w124-zone.com/downloads/M...00.pdf#page=24

    This fancysetup was only offered on the late .036 in Europe; no other 124 chassis had it. Per the link above, the system was standard on most W140 with V8 or V12 engines, and the R129 V12 through ~1998 (pre-SA).


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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    Quote Originally Posted by JC220 View Post
    I believe my 500E does have a switchable master cylinder from factory.
    If it was produced in 1992 or earlier, it probably does not. The FSM indicates the switching MC was implemented as of 02/1993 production (a few months before facelift production began), the EPC says it was as of Euro chassis B927761.


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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    Quote Originally Posted by gsxr View Post
    I can clarify a bit on the "new" master cylinder. The FSM explains it better than I can... see section G of job 42-0700, linked below. Note there are 4 pages of information:

    http://www.w124-zone.com/downloads/M...00.pdf#page=24

    This fancysetup was only offered on the late .036 in Europe; no other 124 chassis had it. Per the link above, the system was standard on most W140 with V8 or V12 engines, and the R129 V12 through ~1998 (pre-SA).

    Thanks, Dave. It now makes total sense to me why larger rear brakes without the revised braking bias (from the "new" master cylinder) makes no difference, despite the additional swept area.

    Cheers,

    maw

    P.S. Thanks for nothing, Klink. Jokes...
    Attached Files Attached Files

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  11. #906
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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    Quote Originally Posted by gsxr View Post
    If it was produced in 1992 or earlier, it probably does not. The FSM indicates the switching MC was implemented as of 02/1993 production (a few months before facelift production began), the EPC says it was as of Euro chassis B927761.

    Thanks Dave, the reason why I thought mine might have been switchable is because of the electrical plug / device located right under the MC in my 500E. (It is also connected via a vacuum line to the ASR/ABS Pump)

    IMG_6403.JPG

    Thankyou very much to GSXR & Klink for their input on the rear SA brake upgrade I do think I will go ahead with it – if anyone has the SA rear callipers for a good price please PM me

    The reason I am going ahead is I will be swapping over complete brake setups between cars as described a few posts back. I want the 500 to have 4x all new matching cross drilled rotors and it already has brand new discs so it would be a shame to junk them.

    My 500's 'old' brakes to be swapped to the E36 AMG-

    IMG_3276.JPG IMG_3622.JPG

    And the E36's brakes to then move onto the 320CE-

    IMG_0182.JPG IMG_0366.JPG

    Regarding fitment issues my 124's are all good for the upgrades - One has new Lemforder LCA’s clearance and the rest have either original or newly fitted late type LCA’s. They all have stainless hoses too and the larger type rear brake shields. (My 500E will be getting new rear wheel bearings and larger sheilds anyway as part of restoration so that's OK) So I’m good to swap each brake set between cars.

    Last edited by JC220; 6 Days Ago at 12:23 PM.
    1987 w124 200 E36 AMG Project car - ongoing 1990 w124 300E-24 Fully Restored
    1992 w124 500E Rolling Restoration - ongoing 1994 C124 E320 - Recently acquired resto project
    2007 w211 E220CDI Avantgarde Daily Driver
    Parted out myself- 95 C36 AMG / 95 E250D / 98 w124 India E220

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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    Quote Originally Posted by JC220 View Post
    Thanks Dave, the reason why I thought mine might have been switchable is because of the electrical plug / device located right under the MC in my 500E. (It is also connected via a vacuum line to the ASR/ABS Pump)

    IMG_6403.JPG
    Joe, that is the pre-charge pump for the ASR system. It should be present on all years of E500E.


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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    My garage is still way too cold & miserable to start the welding... but some more work was done on the interior. The mat wells were pretty dirty. They were cleaned by the PO once every decade whether it needed it or it

    IMG_6459.JPG IMG_6460.JPG

    Someone had also had a go at DIY metal pedal covers.... in 5mm steel

    IMG_6513.JPG

    I used a small carpet spot cleaner machine to pull about a gallon of black water from the carpets –(No that’s NOT Guinness!) and fitted new gen-u-whine stainless pedal covers.


    IMG_6464.JPG IMG_6479.JPG IMG_6514.JPG IMG_6515.JPG IMG_6512.JPG

    The driver’s undermat had to be replaced with another matching used one as there was a small mark in the original that wouldn’t come out. (There are new overmats for the CE also) And I was excited to receive my first ever cross drilled brake rotors – for my 500’s Silver Arrow conversion. ATE Made in Germany items – super quality stuff. Ordering ATE SA rears now too from the same vendor.

    IMG_6505.JPG IMG_6506.JPG IMG_6507.JPG IMG_6510.JPG
    1987 w124 200 E36 AMG Project car - ongoing 1990 w124 300E-24 Fully Restored
    1992 w124 500E Rolling Restoration - ongoing 1994 C124 E320 - Recently acquired resto project
    2007 w211 E220CDI Avantgarde Daily Driver
    Parted out myself- 95 C36 AMG / 95 E250D / 98 w124 India E220

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  17. #909
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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    Really good stuff Joe. Extremely interested to see how you get along with the SA upgrade and if you notice any huge improvements. I’ve always wanted to do it, but, I have the early style LCA and I’m running AMG 3piece so not sure if they would even fit on that rim.

    Curious to see your progress!

    thanks
    Matin

    1992 500E - JAPAN SPEC

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  19. #910
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    Re: OWNER - JC220

    Quote Originally Posted by Matin View Post
    Really good stuff Joe. Extremely interested to see how you get along with the SA upgrade and if you notice any huge improvements. I’ve always wanted to do it, but, I have the early style LCA and I’m running AMG 3piece so not sure if they would even fit on that rim.

    Curious to see your progress!

    thanks
    Hi Matin,


    Thanks – yes I’ll post how the SA upgrade goes. I’ve ordered Metallic Gunmetal Grey Calliper paint for the SA items when they turn up. And have Brembo calliper decals. I’ll blast and spray the fronts whilst the rears from Jeff are already blasted / rebuilt and should just need sprayed.


    My 500E already had late E500 / SL600 320mm brakes up front with stainless Hel brake lines so they were very good! I just lusted after cross drilled rotors and SA callipers so pulled the trigger so to speak. I’m not expecting to feel any major improvement at normal speeds but I sure am looking forward to testing them out. I’ll need to pull my 500E’s rear hubs sooner than expected to facilitate fitting larger rear brake shields (required for SA rear conversions). I may well fit new front brake shields at the same time also - perhaps late R129 items will play nicer with the SA upgrade. It’ll take a month or so to gather up all the parts needed then I’ll post details on how it went.

    1987 w124 200 E36 AMG Project car - ongoing 1990 w124 300E-24 Fully Restored
    1992 w124 500E Rolling Restoration - ongoing 1994 C124 E320 - Recently acquired resto project
    2007 w211 E220CDI Avantgarde Daily Driver
    Parted out myself- 95 C36 AMG / 95 E250D / 98 w124 India E220

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